Universe2.0/Generations Review Thread

[Dominic]

Lewis' feeding frenzy with the TF4 hitting street date resulted in him finding me clean copies of Swerve and Cosmos.

Cosmos/Payload

Swerve/Flanker

Short review/random thoughts:

The new Commanders are much improved over the first two waves. Honestly, there is no real comparison. The designers have gotten better about economizing joints for the conversion and articulation. The only real down-grade is the loss of the hand-weapon. But, neither Swerve nor Cosmos are supposed to be particularly well armed.


Swerve (truck) and Flanker (UAV) are a better set over-all, even discounting the obvious boost Swerve gets by virtue of actually being in the comics. (The package profile does not describe the character from "More than Meets the Eye". But, the facial sculpt is undeniable based on the comic.) Swerve and Flanker are arguably in scale, (in contrast to Bumblebee and Blazemaster which are clearly out of scale).

Cosmos (spacecraft) is a better robot and vehicle than Swerve. But, the set as a whole suffers for Payload comparing so badly to Flanker.

[BWprowl]

The new Commanders are much improved over the first two waves.

Did you even ever get/see the Megatron/Starscream wave? That was a very strong set of toys, and I would not bitch about that Commander Starscream becoming the new 'standard' Seeker mold if Hasbro wants to whore it out 7-8 times (I'm at least getting that Acid Storm that's coming out).

This wave still kind of annoys me, Swerve being pretty boring-looking and Cosmos being emblematic of Hasbro's asshole policy of putting out a new version of a dude barely a few years after we already got a new version of said dude. And I'm still going to be a hypocrite and buy both of them, probably, mostly because of how impressed I was by the preceding wave.

[Dominic]

I have the Megatron. But, Cosmos and Swerve just seem like better toys. (And, as much as I am not a fan of Payload, Payload is still better than the Insecticon that Megatron comes with.)

...Cosmos being emblematic of Hasbro's asshole policy of putting out a new version...

Not sure what the problem is with Hasbro making an improved figure, especially when the last one was rare. (I only saw it in comic shops and online.)

[BWprowl]

I have the Megatron. But, Cosmos and Swerve just seem like better toys.

Details, specifics, tangibles man. You can't just say they 'feel' better, what about them is so much better?

(And, as much as I am not a fan of Payload, Payload is still better than the Insecticon that Megatron comes with.)

Chop Shop's great, he looks good in both main modes, and has a cleverly-connected weapon mode for vehicle mode. He's fun for a lil' bonus pack-in guy.

Not sure what the problem is with Hasbro making an improved figure, especially when the last one was rare. (I only saw it in comic shops and online.)

Because it's explicitly a shitty thing to do in the face of people who did buy and enjoy the previous version (not to mention the people who worked on actually making that one). What reason do I even have to buy this new Cosmos now, knowing that Hasbro's just going to turn around and release a *slightly better* one a couple years down the line? This type of thinking really destroys the will to collect and sucks all the fun out of the hobby. It's like, I really really like the new Springer and Rhinox Hasbro has put out in the last year, I think those are near-perfect toys, some of the best they've made, I genuinely enjoy them. So it's going to feel really shitty when, a couple years from now, they release some brand-new versions to replace those, going "Ha ha, got you, you dumb fucker. Those toys suck and you were never supposed to actually like them. Pony up for these new, better versions, ya prick." What's even the point?

[Shockwave]

You have a point. Especially when one considers Warpath. First they released the Legends version (at the same time as Cosmos BTW) and then released him in full deluxe scale. I could easily see Hasbro doing the same with Cosmos later on, releasing either a deluxe or voyager scale figure.

Of course, then it becomes a matter of scale and having the same figures in different sizes. Functionally, this is going to mean a different displa. I mean, you wouldn't put deluxe Warpath in the battle display with Titan Metroplex. Becuase they're out of scale to each other. So then you have two, the small one for the mini battle display and the larger one to interact with other larger figures.

[JediTricks]

The new Commanders are much improved over the first two waves.

Did you even ever get/see the Megatron/Starscream wave? That was a very strong set of toys, and I would not bitch about that Commander Starscream becoming the new 'standard' Seeker mold if Hasbro wants to whore it out 7-8 times (I'm at least getting that Acid Storm that's coming out).

This wave still kind of annoys me, Swerve being pretty boring-looking and Cosmos being emblematic of Hasbro's asshole policy of putting out a new version of a dude barely a few years after we already got a new version of said dude. And I'm still going to be a hypocrite and buy both of them, probably, mostly because of how impressed I was by the preceding wave.

I'm with Dom on it, Megatron isn't half as satisfying as Swerve and Cosmos - there's too much fiddly business that really doesn't pay off well on Megs, joints that only sort of work right and sort of pull the figure apart, a mediocre cannon weapon, and scale issues at the head and hands, stuff that doesn't hold together as well as it should, stuff that doesn't look nice. I like the minicon with Megs a little better, but he's not as good a weapon either. Megs is arguably the best of the 2013 Generations Legends and he's fairly middling compared to Swerve and Cosmos IMO.

The previous Cosmos is kinda shitty-looking, FIVE years old, and nigh-impossible to find, the idea that it should count as anything other than a collectible really doesn't jive with me. That era of Legends - the ones made for drug stores - have really thin-walled, compromised designs and unappealing ball joints in a way that doesn't fit in well with modern figures.

[Tigermegatron]

I have the Megatron. But, Cosmos and Swerve just seem like better toys.

Details, specifics, tangibles man. You can't just say they 'feel' better, what about them is so much better?

(And, as much as I am not a fan of Payload, Payload is still better than the Insecticon that Megatron comes with.)

Chop Shop's great, he looks good in both main modes, and has a cleverly-connected weapon mode for vehicle mode. He's fun for a lil' bonus pack-in guy.

Not sure what the problem is with Hasbro making an improved figure, especially when the last one was rare. (I only saw it in comic shops and online.)

Because it's explicitly a shitty thing to do in the face of people who did buy and enjoy the previous version (not to mention the people who worked on actually making that one). What reason do I even have to buy this new Cosmos now, knowing that Hasbro's just going to turn around and release a *slightly better* one a couple years down the line? This type of thinking really destroys the will to collect and sucks all the fun out of the hobby. It's like, I really really like the new Springer and Rhinox Hasbro has put out in the last year, I think those are near-perfect toys, some of the best they've made, I genuinely enjoy them. So it's going to feel really shitty when, a couple years from now, they release some brand-new versions to replace those, going "Ha ha, got you, you dumb fucker. Those toys suck and you were never supposed to actually like them. Pony up for these new, better versions, ya prick." What's even the point?

This reads like you are upset about your older TF toys being worth less on the secondary market due to newer versions being made.

[Onslaught Six]

I can't see the argument in terms of Cosmos; like JT said, that was FIVE years ago, and that toy was impossible to find. I suspect the entire reason Warpath was redone as a Deluxe was because he was equally difficult to find.

They aren't doing it as a particular slight against you, or anyone who likes these ones--I really wonder where that random hostility comes from. You don't like it? You don't have to buy it! I mean, okay, they make a new Movie Bumblebee literally every other year. (Depending on how the movie toyline stretches, sometimes it's even every year. Or even less.) I bought NewBee in 2008 and that was enough for me until 2010 when they released a way better Bumblebee (in BBBB), and then they proceeded to release even more Bumblebees, but I liked the one I had so I stuck to that one. Likewise, ROTF Prime is pretty much a definitive toy for me (accessory choices aside) and so I have no desire to buy another Movie Prime ever again, no matter how many times they change his design in the films. I'm not *offended* that they continue to make new ones of the same character just because my particular favourite version is now "outdated."

Hell, they made a new Generations Onslaught, and this one was even a combiner, but my favourite is still the Universe Ultra. They could make new Onslaughts every year until I die and I wouldn't mind.

It's not unreasonable to expect Hasbro might do new toys of certain characters on a semi-frequent basis. (I'm going to maintain that "five years inbetween releases" isn't even "semi-frequent" but whatever.) These toys, despite being more recent, are not inherently "better" than the one you got before; they're simply different. Likewise, there are updated toys of dudes that I explicitly didn't buy because I thought they looked shitty.

You remember back in the Energon and Cybertron days? Pretty much the first thing at least one of us would say, upon a bunch of new toys, was, "I like this mould, but I'll wait for the inevitable repaint and then decide if I like that better." Sometimes these toys were literally the same character, the same exact mould, just in different colours, with a dumb thing like "Energon" or "Powerlinx" shoved in the front of their name! To me, that's way more the "bait and switch" you're describing. Like, "Haha, suckers! You bought the original Autobot Butthole, but there was actually ALWAYS going to be a newer Powerlinx Autobot Butthole coming out later with better colours!"

And yet, despite that, sometimes the "better" colours wouldn't be better at all, depending on your tastes. Cybertron Hot Shot got a repaint in Hot Rod-esque colours as Excilion; guess which one I picked up? Hot Shot. The original colours appealed to me more.

It's the exact same shit now. The new Jetfire (or Cosmos, or Springer) doesn't "invalidate" any previous versions of the toy. Those are still just as available as they ever were. But let's say I didn't like a certain aspect of the last Jetfire, and this new Jetfire does what I want. Let's pretend the new Jetfire has a Valkyrie head, which is something I want in a Jetfire, and so I instantly am happy that there's a Jetfire that's closer to what I would want out of a Jetfire toy.

I know some people were unhappy with Generations Blurr's head, because it's more like IDW's than the G1 cartoon's. I'm sure if Hasbro put out a new-mould Blurr with a G1 cartoon head, they'd immediately buy it and sell their Generations Blurr, but I don't have to do that just because everyone else is. I can keep Generations Blurr because that's the one I like, and I'm sure there's other people--even people inside Hasbro!--who prefer the first one. That's the whole point of options and different toys, isn't it?

I mean, wasn't that a big conclusion we all came to in the mid-00s? "If you don't like the current incarnation of TF, wait a year?" Why can't that apply to certain characters or toys, too?

[BWprowl]

I'm with Dom on it, Megatron isn't half as satisfying as Swerve and Cosmos - there's too much fiddly business that really doesn't pay off well on Megs, joints that only sort of work right and sort of pull the figure apart, a mediocre cannon weapon, and scale issues at the head and hands, stuff that doesn't hold together as well as it should, stuff that doesn't look nice. I like the minicon with Megs a little better, but he's not as good a weapon either. Megs is arguably the best of the 2013 Generations Legends and he's fairly middling compared to Swerve and Cosmos IMO.

On some level, I can kinda see what you're talking about: Megs's legs are kinda iffy in their posability, and I wish his turret went together a bit more solidly in vehicle mode, but he's hardly the mess you describe him as.

I think one point that needs to be made is I haven't even seen Swerve and Cosmos on shelves yet, let alone been able to actually handle them, so it's kinda flying over my head as a concept how they could actually be so much better than Megatron and Starscream, who I really enjoyed. Especially since Swerve and Cosmos looked so unremarkable and conventional from pictures, so I'm having a hard time figuring what could be so great about them. Swerve is literally just a red truck who turns into a blocky, standard robot, what could possibly be so standout about that?

The previous Cosmos is kinda shitty-looking, FIVE years old, and nigh-impossible to find, the idea that it should count as anything other than a collectible really doesn't jive with me. That era of Legends - the ones made for drug stores - have really thin-walled, compromised designs and unappealing ball joints in a way that doesn't fit in well with modern figures.

I'm kind of blown away that a mere five years ago apparently doesn't count as 'modern' anymore. I mean for god's sake, I still think of the Classics toys as 'modern' figures of whatever characters they're homaging.

I can't see the argument in terms of Cosmos; like JT said, that was FIVE years ago, and that toy was impossible to find. I suspect the entire reason Warpath was redone as a Deluxe was because he was equally difficult to find.

See, Warpath is a different story since it's being done at a completely different scale. No one's going to compare a Legends version of a character against a Deluxe version, it's nonsensical and unfair to both versions, it's the same story for, say, Legends vs Deluxe Trailcutter; they're aiming to do different things, so co-existing is fine. Hell, they even salvaged the Legends Warpath after the fact by repainting it into a decent Gutcruncher homage. But with making a character TWICE at the same scale, especially a nobody like Cosmos who it's frankly kind of amazing even got ONE new toy, it comes off as kind of incongruous. It's like, what did the team at Hasbro find so offensive about the original Legends Cosmos that they had to re-do it and correct it so soon after? I genuinely wonder.

They aren't doing it as a particular slight against you, or anyone who likes these ones--I really wonder where that random hostility comes from. You don't like it? You don't have to buy it! I mean, okay, they make a new Movie Bumblebee literally every other year. (Depending on how the movie toyline stretches, sometimes it's even every year. Or even less.) I bought NewBee in 2008 and that was enough for me until 2010 when they released a way better Bumblebee (in BBBB), and then they proceeded to release even more Bumblebees, but I liked the one I had so I stuck to that one. Likewise, ROTF Prime is pretty much a definitive toy for me (accessory choices aside) and so I have no desire to buy another Movie Prime ever again, no matter how many times they change his design in the films. I'm not *offended* that they continue to make new ones of the same character just because my particular favourite version is now "outdated."

Hell, they made a new Generations Onslaught, and this one was even a combiner, but my favourite is still the Universe Ultra. They could make new Onslaughts every year until I die and I wouldn't mind.

It's not unreasonable to expect Hasbro might do new toys of certain characters on a semi-frequent basis. (I'm going to maintain that "five years inbetween releases" isn't even "semi-frequent" but whatever.) These toys, despite being more recent, are not inherently "better" than the one you got before; they're simply different. Likewise, there are updated toys of dudes that I explicitly didn't buy because I thought they looked shitty.

That's a thing though, a lot of these 'updates' are seen as and agreed upon to be inferior versions of what came before. Sometimes there's a reason for this (Generations FoC Onslaught has to be a Combiner core, and a Deluxe besides) so you can understand why they would turn out so differently and unfavorable. But the point of it all is that you still have that previous version you liked, and it's not suddenly invalidated in the public eye of everyone *else* just because a shiny new version got trotted out. I've gotten to that before, and I'll get to it again.

It's the exact same shit now. The new Jetfire (or Cosmos, or Springer) doesn't "invalidate" any previous versions of the toy. Those are still just as available as they ever were. But let's say I didn't like a certain aspect of the last Jetfire, and this new Jetfire does what I want. Let's pretend the new Jetfire has a Valkyrie head, which is something I want in a Jetfire, and so I instantly am happy that there's a Jetfire that's closer to what I would want out of a Jetfire toy.

See, you talk about Jetfire here, and that's the one I keep coming back to, because that's the one that set me off the first time we saw it. Because sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who actually remembers Classics. Like I'm the only one who remembers Classics Jetfire coming out and everyone agreeing that that toy was pretty much the bee's knees. There was a shit-ton of love for that toy! People were raving about it! For fuck's sake, TWO of my friends who don't even collect toys bought it for themselves because it was just that cool a toy! So when Hasbro unveiled Generations Jetfire a few months back, my reaction was understandably a perplexed "Why? I thought we already had the perfect Jetfire that everyone loved?"

And it would've been a different thing if I'd seen more personal preference like you bring up there, if I'd seen mostly people going "Oh this one's closer to the Skyfire design, I'll get it for that" or what have you. But instead, as soon as this...thing was revealed, all you fucking heard was about how much everyone apparently hated Classics Jetfire! How we'd apparently been suffering with this piss-poor attempt at the design for so long and only NOW were we getting the right version! Just pages and pages of people extolling the virtues of this new toy while simultaneously just shitting all over the old version, which I was still under the impression we were supposed to love! I didn't get this memo!

It's that mentality of "A new version came out so the old version automatically sucks ass" that drives me away so hardcore from this character re-use/re-making thing, and conspires with how goddamn fickle the fandom is. Similar things happened with Classics Optimus Prime, where it seems like everyone was blowing themselves over how cool and perfect and everything we wanted that toy was just a few years back, and now everyone's whining for a new version! Why even beg for a new one if you're apparently just going to want a NEW new one a few more years later?

I mean, wasn't that a big conclusion we all came to in the mid-00s? "If you don't like the current incarnation of TF, wait a year?" Why can't that apply to certain characters or toys, too?

That's the thing, I didn't even know we *didn't* like the previous Jetfire, or even the previous Cosmos (I recall some fond things said about the original Legends one when it came out, but now there's a new one, so it sucks shit)!

I mean, fine, make all the new Movie Bumblebees you want, that's expected, we've grown accustomed to that. But not something like Classics Jetfire. I loved Classics Jetfire. I thought we all loved Classics Jetfire. And now you show me that all you have to do is wave a bigger size-class and a fake cockpit in people's faces and all of a sudden they hate Classics Jetfire? That's just so damn...jarring.

[Tigermegatron]

I'm with Dom on it, Megatron isn't half as satisfying as Swerve and Cosmos - there's too much fiddly business that really doesn't pay off well on Megs, joints that only sort of work right and sort of pull the figure apart, a mediocre cannon weapon, and scale issues at the head and hands, stuff that doesn't hold together as well as it should, stuff that doesn't look nice. I like the minicon with Megs a little better, but he's not as good a weapon either. Megs is arguably the best of the 2013 Generations Legends and he's fairly middling compared to Swerve and Cosmos IMO.

On some level, I can kinda see what you're talking about: Megs's legs are kinda iffy in their posability, and I wish his turret went together a bit more solidly in vehicle mode, but he's hardly the mess you describe him as.

I think one point that needs to be made is I haven't even seen Swerve and Cosmos on shelves yet, let alone been able to actually handle them, so it's kinda flying over my head as a concept how they could actually be so much better than Megatron and Starscream, who I really enjoyed. Especially since Swerve and Cosmos looked so unremarkable and conventional from pictures, so I'm having a hard time figuring what could be so great about them. Swerve is literally just a red truck who turns into a blocky, standard robot, what could possibly be so standout about that?

The previous Cosmos is kinda shitty-looking, FIVE years old, and nigh-impossible to find, the idea that it should count as anything other than a collectible really doesn't jive with me. That era of Legends - the ones made for drug stores - have really thin-walled, compromised designs and unappealing ball joints in a way that doesn't fit in well with modern figures.

I'm kind of blown away that a mere five years ago apparently doesn't count as 'modern' anymore. I mean for god's sake, I still think of the Classics toys as 'modern' figures of whatever characters they're homaging.

I can't see the argument in terms of Cosmos; like JT said, that was FIVE years ago, and that toy was impossible to find. I suspect the entire reason Warpath was redone as a Deluxe was because he was equally difficult to find.

See, Warpath is a different story since it's being done at a completely different scale. No one's going to compare a Legends version of a character against a Deluxe version, it's nonsensical and unfair to both versions, it's the same story for, say, Legends vs Deluxe Trailcutter; they're aiming to do different things, so co-existing is fine. Hell, they even salvaged the Legends Warpath after the fact by repainting it into a decent Gutcruncher homage. But with making a character TWICE at the same scale, especially a nobody like Cosmos who it's frankly kind of amazing even got ONE new toy, it comes off as kind of incongruous. It's like, what did the team at Hasbro find so offensive about the original Legends Cosmos that they had to re-do it and correct it so soon after? I genuinely wonder.

They aren't doing it as a particular slight against you, or anyone who likes these ones--I really wonder where that random hostility comes from. You don't like it? You don't have to buy it! I mean, okay, they make a new Movie Bumblebee literally every other year. (Depending on how the movie toyline stretches, sometimes it's even every year. Or even less.) I bought NewBee in 2008 and that was enough for me until 2010 when they released a way better Bumblebee (in BBBB), and then they proceeded to release even more Bumblebees, but I liked the one I had so I stuck to that one. Likewise, ROTF Prime is pretty much a definitive toy for me (accessory choices aside) and so I have no desire to buy another Movie Prime ever again, no matter how many times they change his design in the films. I'm not *offended* that they continue to make new ones of the same character just because my particular favourite version is now "outdated."

Hell, they made a new Generations Onslaught, and this one was even a combiner, but my favourite is still the Universe Ultra. They could make new Onslaughts every year until I die and I wouldn't mind.

It's not unreasonable to expect Hasbro might do new toys of certain characters on a semi-frequent basis. (I'm going to maintain that "five years inbetween releases" isn't even "semi-frequent" but whatever.) These toys, despite being more recent, are not inherently "better" than the one you got before; they're simply different. Likewise, there are updated toys of dudes that I explicitly didn't buy because I thought they looked shitty.

That's a thing though, a lot of these 'updates' are seen as and agreed upon to be inferior versions of what came before. Sometimes there's a reason for this (Generations FoC Onslaught has to be a Combiner core, and a Deluxe besides) so you can understand why they would turn out so differently and unfavorable. But the point of it all is that you still have that previous version you liked, and it's not suddenly invalidated in the public eye of everyone *else* just because a shiny new version got trotted out. I've gotten to that before, and I'll get to it again.

It's the exact same shit now. The new Jetfire (or Cosmos, or Springer) doesn't "invalidate" any previous versions of the toy. Those are still just as available as they ever were. But let's say I didn't like a certain aspect of the last Jetfire, and this new Jetfire does what I want. Let's pretend the new Jetfire has a Valkyrie head, which is something I want in a Jetfire, and so I instantly am happy that there's a Jetfire that's closer to what I would want out of a Jetfire toy.

See, you talk about Jetfire here, and that's the one I keep coming back to, because that's the one that set me off the first time we saw it. Because sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who actually remembers Classics. Like I'm the only one who remembers Classics Jetfire coming out and everyone agreeing that that toy was pretty much the bee's knees. There was a shit-ton of love for that toy! People were raving about it! For fuck's sake, TWO of my friends who don't even collect toys bought it for themselves because it was just that cool a toy! So when Hasbro unveiled Generations Jetfire a few months back, my reaction was understandably a perplexed "Why? I thought we already had the perfect Jetfire that everyone loved?"

And it would've been a different thing if I'd seen more personal preference like you bring up there, if I'd seen mostly people going "Oh this one's closer to the Skyfire design, I'll get it for that" or what have you. But instead, as soon as this...thing was revealed, all you fucking heard was about how much everyone apparently hated Classics Jetfire! How we'd apparently been suffering with this piss-poor attempt at the design for so long and only NOW were we getting the right version! Just pages and pages of people extolling the virtues of this new toy while simultaneously just shitting all over the old version, which I was still under the impression we were supposed to love! I didn't get this memo!

It's that mentality of "A new version came out so the old version automatically sucks ass" that drives me away so hardcore from this character re-use/re-making thing, and conspires with how goddamn fickle the fandom is. Similar things happened with Classics Optimus Prime, where it seems like everyone was blowing themselves over how cool and perfect and everything we wanted that toy was just a few years back, and now everyone's whining for a new version! Why even beg for a new one if you're apparently just going to want a NEW new one a few more years later?

I mean, wasn't that a big conclusion we all came to in the mid-00s? "If you don't like the current incarnation of TF, wait a year?" Why can't that apply to certain characters or toys, too?

That's the thing, I didn't even know we *didn't* like the previous Jetfire, or even the previous Cosmos (I recall some fond things said about the original Legends one when it came out, but now there's a new one, so it sucks shit)!

I mean, fine, make all the new Movie Bumblebees you want, that's expected, we've grown accustomed to that. But not something like Classics Jetfire. I loved Classics Jetfire. I thought we all loved Classics Jetfire. And now you show me that all you have to do is wave a bigger size-class and a fake cockpit in people's faces and all of a sudden they hate Classics Jetfire? That's just so damn...jarring.

Complaining about too many toy versions of the same TF character toy is like complaining that your new high school has way to many hot sexy pretty girls in over abundance. Variety is a great thing never a negative. It allows a person to choose the best version or give them more choices to get more.

I like the options of multiple repaints & multiple toys released based off the same character. It allows me to pick the best colors/persona on that mold. Newer toys based of the same characters gives me more options to pick the design & size I better seek.

I still think,BW Prowl,Has ulterior motives in these rants. BW Prowl is probably upset his older TF toys are worth less on the secondary market thanks to newer versions decreasing the value of older versions. Hasbro will only go so far to please the adult fans. Hasbro will not stop creating newer versions of Characters just so adult fans toys can keep growing in secondary market value. Hasbro makes nothing off the secondary market sales. BW Prowls rants make no sense, if a newer better version comes out & you want to get rid of the older version,just sell it or give it away to a younger relative.

Lets not forget,Hasbro calculates that over 95% of it TF toy sales worldwide come from kids. Kids have short attention spans & gow up too fast. The average kids will only buy TF toys for a few years until he moves on to other things. When new kids leave,newer younger kids replace them. Those younger kids buy newer store toys not ebay resold toys. Hasbro keeps making newer versions of the same TF character to give that newer kid a chance to own that TF character.

Once again,TF toys are not meant to hoarde or keep as future investment pieces. The TF toys are meant to be played with & enjoyed. If your looking for investments then buy gold,silver,bonds or stock not toys.

Lastly, I think it's kinda selfish to want things to stop. As the feelings or desires of others isn't considered. its just selfish to deny others the opportunity to buy things you don't want. I still remember those selfish Botcon members being upset that Hasbro was releasing those Classics 1.0 Deluxe seekers that they sold as exclusives. Hasbro did use different retooling & different colors. Those selfish fans were upset their botcon toys would be worth less on the secondary market.