Primal and AirRazor- love in the air ;)

[Dominic]

Actually, the correct parsing is "toyhack", sans the hyphen that I put in.

How did you define "toy-hack" again? Because as I recall, that's getting into a whole different argument...

As has been pointed out, a large portion of the fandom is *very* resistant to change. As I see it, BW fans have less excuse for this than any other portion of the fanbase, as they were the first group of fans to have to deal with that resistance, (in all of its obnoxious stupidity), directly. Along similar lines, they did not even have the long-term dry spell that GeeWunners had, meaning Beasties fans have less excuse to be so damned obsessive about their hobby.

[Sparky Prime]

I still don't see how that constitutes a "toyhack" as the term would imply something to do with the toys while you use the phrase only in context of the fiction, but anyway... I really don't see that BW fans are particularly resistant to change compared to any other part of the fandom. BW fans certainly don't even come anywhere close to the "truk not munky" Geewun fans. Again, the biggest concerns I see from Beast Wars fans is the quality of the stories.

[Shockwave]

the biggest concerns I see from Beast Wars fans is the quality of the stories.

That's a good point and it probably stems from BW fans having grown up and having the BW show as their introduction point they would naturally expect the rest of the fiction that follows to be up to that same standard. Little did they know how bad the writing for G1 was and as such didn't have that as the norm to expect. I will freely admit to being a G1 toyhack as I tend to prefer the original character bios rather than the cartoon.

Shockwave
-fibrir. FIBRIR!!

[BWprowl]

I still don't see how that constitutes a "toyhack" as the term would imply something to do with the toys while you use the phrase only in context of the fiction, but anyway... I really don't see that BW fans are particularly resistant to change compared to any other part of the fandom. BW fans certainly don't even come anywhere close to the "truk not munky" Geewun fans. Again, the biggest concerns I see from Beast Wars fans is the quality of the stories.

What crazy alternate universe are you living in? Because where I'm from, most BW fans IMMEDIATELY hated the series that came after Beast Wars: Beast Machines. Just as the 'TRUKK NOT MUNKEE'-ers before them, we got tons of cries of "It never happened! I don't count it! Lalalala I'm not listening!". All simply because it was different than what had come before.

Geewunners had a dry spell of a couple of years to get ready to hate the next big change in TF. BW toyhacks didn't even get that much time to prepare, and they still responded with the same level of vitriol.

[Sparky Prime]

What crazy alternate universe are you living in? Because where I'm from, most BW fans IMMEDIATELY hated the series that came after Beast Wars: Beast Machines. Just as the 'TRUKK NOT MUNKEE'-ers before them, we got tons of cries of "It never happened! I don't count it! Lalalala I'm not listening!". All simply because it was different than what had come before.

Immediately? No, as I remember it, fans were excited to see the surviving Beast Wars cast fighting it out back on their home planet, despite early criticisms of the Maximals new robot modes and transformations. It took a little while before fans actually started to hate the series. And I've never seen anyone try to argue 'just because it was different' as a reason for it. Beast Machines has a unique distinction in that is picks up right where Beast Wars left off, essentially making it a season 4 and 5 of the series. As such, again, BW fans complaints towards Beast Machines are aimed towards elements in the quality of the overall storyline. One of the biggest complaints is the portrayal of characters in BM being inconsistent with how they were established in BW for example.

The cries of 'it never happened' seem to stem more from the plot point of Cybertron once being organic and being reformatted at the conclusion of the series. That's more of a complaint once again coming from G1 though, as Beast Wars didn't establish any of Cybertron's history.

Geewunners had a dry spell of a couple of years to get ready to hate the next big change in TF. BW toyhacks didn't even get that much time to prepare, and they still responded with the same level of vitriol.

I'd think a dry spell should make it easier for fans to accept change actually. With the franchise more or less dead at the time, any effort to revive the franchise would be something at least. Although that obviously didn't hold true for every fan of G1. But still, Beast Wars did end up jump starting the popularity of Transformers, helping get it to where it is today. Changes made from one season to the next though is going to be much more jarring to the audience. Yet, I wouldn't say BW fans reacted to BM like the "truk not munky" G1 fans did to BW.

[BWprowl]

Yet, I wouldn't say BW fans reacted to BM like the "truk not munky" G1 fans did to BW.

They threatened to kill Bob Skir. That's a little intense.

[Onslaught Six]

Ten years later, and /co/ still insists BM never existed. Go try and make a thread. They will lynch you. (And I'll be there defending BM.)

[Gomess]

Actually, the correct parsing is "toyhack", sans the hyphen that I put in.

But.. it's correctly an acronym..

And yes, the death threats against Bob Skir were very much real and very much a ridiculous indication of the ridiculously rigid mindset amongst certain BW fans, which EASILY equalled the most hardline Geewunners ever known. I mean.. *death threats*. Come the f**k on, Bridget.

[Dominic]

I remember seriously considering making a counter-threat. "Bob Skir, you give us at least one more season of TF, or I will kill you!" Hehehehehehehehehehehe.

And, then of course, there was the time I tried to figure out a way to get Hallit sodomized at BC03. Never got that plan off the ground though.


There was a fair amount of hypocrisy in the BMac hate though. Retconning was perfectly fine when it was BobnLarry on "Beast Wars", (such as mashing up elements of the G1 cartoons and comics). But, Skir doing the same on "Beast Machines", it was just *wrong*, because "Beast Wars" was perfect and wonderful and furry.

I'd think a dry spell should make it easier for fans to accept change actually. With the franchise more or less dead at the time, any effort to revive the franchise would be something at least. Although that obviously didn't hold true for every fan of G1.

It depends how the fandom spends the down-time though. If they spend most of that time, (be it a year or the better part of a decade), re-watching the same old episodes and reading the same comics and displaying the same toys, the down time will only re-enforce their obsession. If they move on and try new things, ("nnnnoooooooooooooooooooooooooooo"), then the down time will make them more accepting.

GeeWunners never quite left the mid to late 80s. "GI Joe" fans largely never got past 1987, with some of the more worldly among them making it into the early 90s.

Look at "Star Trek" fans. Many of the old timers were very resistant to the later series.

But.. it's correctly an acronym..

An acronym is a word that is made from an abbreviation of a phrase. In the case of "toyhack", the word is based on the phonetic pronounciation of a rather awkward abbreviation, (TOIHAAK).


Dom
-only here would we get debates on the language of the hobby.

[Gomess]

An acronym is a word that is made from an abbreviation of a phrase.

...Thanks? *rips up english degree* =p

In the case of "toyhack", the word is based on the phonetic pronounciation of a rather awkward abbreviation, (TOIHAAK).

Yeah, the word is *based* on an acronym, making it a mutation or colloquialism. So, as I said, the *correct*- i.e. original- parsing is "TOIHaaK". This has mutated into "toyhack", for convenience's sake. Such is language.

Honestly, I do find discussing linguistics, grammar and syntax infinitely more interesting than which fanboys are angriest (especially when it's so clearly the RiD freaks).