Watchmen movie discussion

[onslaught86]

Aaaand go.

[donosaur]

bluuuuuuuuuuuuuue penis

[onslaught86]

Lessee.

Opening montage = awesomely well done.
Music and score were excellent, timely, and appropriately chosen.
Rorschach's prison scenes were my favourite of the whole movie.
Didn't drag despite the long run-time, the pacing was well-handled despite the chunks that were cut. Although slightly more obvious upon second viewing.
Comedian's brutality was artfully handled.
Production and set design impressed as well I knew they would.
Not a 300 fan, so pleased to see this emerge as more than bluescreen and posteuring.
The change of ending to villainise Manhatten has rather interesting religious connotations, and is about the only original contribution to the plot.

Excellent to see a property that's high profile to the comic fan become high profile to the moviegoing public as well. Gives me hope we could see, saaaay, a Transmetropolitan movie.

[BWprowl]

"Dr. Manhattan's Penis" has become the base for a wide range of in-jokes between me and my friends since we saw the movie.

I can definitely say that I liked it. I think it actually followed the book a little *too* closely in the beginning, to the point that it felt like it was dragging a bit. But once they got comfortable with the idea of adapting the comic, about a third of the way through, it really began to work. Most of what was cut was about what I expected (No Black Freighter, trimming down the flashbacks), with one exception: I was really shocked to see them completely remove the death of Hollis Mason, especially since it's such a catalyst for Dan's character.

Really though, the only actual gripe I have with the film is with Rorschach’s psychoanalysis scene. It really should’ve been done as two separate sessions like in the comic. The way he goes straight from fake ‘Pretty Flowers’ answers to just spilling his story out to the guy in a matter of seconds just didn’t feel right at all. It should’ve been a little longer, at least enough to also tell the story of how he got his mask (If only because ALL my friends who hadn’t read the book were asking me afterwards what the deal with the mask was). Otherwise though, the whole prison sequence was awesome, thanks mostly to Haley’s excellent portrayal of Rorschach. He pretty much stole that whole movie, as he was rightful to do.

One thing I’ll say that I think the film actually did better than the book was the fight scenes. The movie did a really good job of showing the sheer brutality these heroes are capable of inflicting on their opponents. See: Dan and Laura’s fight with the Top-Knots in the alleyway. They really messed those guys up in subduing them, and that’s an aspect that a lot of lighter superhero movies ignore, but in this case, it’s another example of what Watchmen is all about.

[donosaur]

Had the opportunity to see it again. It holds up, rather than degrading. It is a dense film, mostly in the beginning before the plot takes over. Music was jarring the first time, but seemed to fit better the second time around. I'm also kind of surprised how Hollis Mason's death was left out, otherwise I think the plot cutting was masterful. The new ending is really tight, I approve, but I agree with others that while the film is very true to the source, it doesn't add much that's new. Don't know if that's a cause for disappointment though.

Acting among the core three (Rorschach, Dreiberg, Jon) was solid, the others were shaky at times. Rorschach was pitch perfect, Dreiberg was a natural, but while I remember Dan being the more sympathetic of the two in the book, here Rorschach displayed more charisma. Dr. Manhattan was the only character that was portrayed radically differently than I expected based on the book, and I am happily surprised. I was having a conversation after the movie and realized I was affectating his speech patterns. Oops. There may be more flaws i'm missing (what is up with Nixon? seriously) but I'm on a high because the second viewing was also a date that went really really well

Funny thing I noticed: Retro Batman posters in one of the early scenes, perhaps the montage. Doesn't fit with that universe, what could Snyder have been playing at? I caught his nod to 300 in the first fight, but I'm not sure why Bats is showing up. Hrm.

Hrm.

[Dominic]

Why are "Batman" posters not consistent with the context? "Watchmen" was never set in DC, so the characters could have "Batman" comics on hand.


In any case, I saw it. It is hardly the worst thing I have seen, even in recent years. But, my general dislike of the source material hurts this movie. It was, generally, done well.

I assume the Hollis Mason Owl's death, along with more explication about the original team and Kovachack's therapy sessions and newspaper reading habits, will be added to a later dvd release.

The only change that really irked me was the end. It did not have to be a squid-creature, but Ozymandias' McGuffin being alive was an important thematic element. True, O still nuked his cat and murdered his staff, but the living McGiffin added something that neither of those things carried.

Dom
-notes that "Squadron Supreme" is a better, and less pretentious, story.

[donosaur]

In the watchmen universe, since superheroes exist, superhero comics don't exist. Pirate comics are the most popular genre for comics, hence the black freighter. So, that's why batman shouldn't exist

[Dominic]

Good catch there Don.

I suppose that in-context, the reasoning would be something like "well, the real world has both crime and crime comics, war and war comics." But, yeah, good catch.

The real reason is probably that the director wanted have a comic reference, because "Nite-Owl is Batman, not the Blue Beetle, of course....."

Dom
-notes how Ozymandias compares himself to a comic baddie in the movie and a movie baddie in the comie.

[Onslaught Six]

-notes how Ozymandias compares himself to a comic baddie in the movie and a movie baddie in the comie.

That line got a good chuckle out of everyone in the audience.

In the watchmen universe, since superheroes exist, superhero comics don't exist. Pirate comics are the most popular genre for comics, hence the black freighter. So, that's why batman shouldn't exist

Hollis Mason mentions Action Comics #1 and Superman in his Under The Hood book, so it's conceivable that Batman at least existed in this universe at some point--it doesn't mean that he's popular and well-known now. I didn't catch it myself, so I can't tell if it was the classic Batman, with the purple gloves and all, or any of the Recent Batmen depictions.

Also, Mason's death was apparently one of the last things Snyder cut out of the movie, and it really tore him up to do it.

(what is up with Nixon? seriously) but I'm on a high because the second viewing was also a date that went really really well

NIXON'S BAAAAAAACK! I said this at least five times during the movie.

Really though, the only actual gripe I have with the film is with Rorschach’s psychoanalysis scene. It really should’ve been done as two separate sessions like in the comic. The way he goes straight from fake ‘Pretty Flowers’ answers to just spilling his story out to the guy in a matter of seconds just didn’t feel right at all.

Incidentally, the movie keeps something intact that I always thought was rushed in the comic: "Do you know how hard it is to be your friend?! ....Hey, I'm sorry I said that, two seconds ago."

It should’ve been a little longer, at least enough to also tell the story of how he got his mask (If only because ALL my friends who hadn’t read the book were asking me afterwards what the deal with the mask was).

I think the tale of the mask was deliberately left out because it's described specifically in the book as being between two layers of latex, while the mask in the movie is so very clearly 'not' latex, at all.

One thing I’ll say that I think the film actually did better than the book was the fight scenes. The movie did a really good job of showing the sheer brutality these heroes are capable of inflicting on their opponents. See: Dan and Laura’s fight with the Top-Knots in the alleyway. They really messed those guys up in subduing them, and that’s an aspect that a lot of lighter superhero movies ignore, but in this case, it’s another example of what Watchmen is all about.

Yes. This movie didn't skimp on the violence at all. Especially the new way Rorschach kills the child murderer.

[BWprowl]

Yes. This movie didn't skimp on the violence at all. Especially the new way Rorschach kills the child murderer.

I'm kind of torn on this one. On the one hand, it's a lot blunter than the comic's version, but there are interesting connotations with this version. In this case, Rorschach directly murders the guy, as opposed to just burning down the building he's in. (Granted the only reason the guy was in the building while it was burning in the comic was because Roschach chained him in there, but you see what I mean?). So it could be argued that this shows a fuller transformation into the brutal Rorschach.

But man, I *really* liked the old death.