andersonh1 wrote:Time makes a big difference here. I'm not too broken up about Vibe being new and different, but Superman is another story. And that doesn't even go into all the characters that are simply gone now, like Wally West or Donna Troy, or the many children and grandchildren of the JSA. Where's Jesse Quick or Atom Smasher?
Okay, I hadn't really taken the time factor into account, expecially since I'd only been following DC for maybe six or seven years until the reset, myself. But I can definitely get that.
For the record, I'm also hella annoyed they just got rid of characters like Wally West, Cassandra Cain, or Stephanie Brown. (How come all the damn Robins get to stick around, but Barbara Gordon has to be the only Batgirl ever? Not to mention completely disregarding the fact that Barbara is infinitely more interesting as Oracle than she ever was as Batgirl.)
BWprowl wrote:Okay, I hadn't really taken the time factor into account, expecially since I'd only been following DC for maybe six or seven years until the reset, myself. But I can definitely get that.
For the record, I'm also hella annoyed they just got rid of characters like Wally West, Cassandra Cain, or Stephanie Brown. (How come all the damn Robins get to stick around, but Barbara Gordon has to be the only Batgirl ever? Not to mention completely disregarding the fact that Barbara is infinitely more interesting as Oracle than she ever was as Batgirl.)
I get what DC was trying to do, for the most part, and that is to shed the majority of legacy characters and get back to the most recognizable versions. They were trying to simplify their universe. So Barbara Gordon goes back to being Batgirl and Barry Allen goes back to being the Flash, etc. But as you point out, it's inconsistent, and some of those legacy characters had been around for a LONG time and had developed into some pretty good characters themselves. The baby's been thrown out with the bathwater here. And it's inconsistent. We keep all the Robins, but not all the Flashes/Kid Flashes? Barbara Gordon grows well beyond her Batgirl role by responding to her paralysis and building a new life, but now she's regressed? The whole thing is a mess.
Getting back to retro comics, I'm still working my way through the Flash archive, and I've run across a story where the age of the material really shows. There is a disclaimer at the beginning of the volume that mentions racism, both concious and unconcious, and that the comics have been reprinted as they originally appeared for historical reasons. The "Yellow Peril" stereotype rears its head as one of the stories deals with "Chinamen" in Chinatown, who are members of a tong, carry hatchets and all have long pigtails. They watch Joan with "slanted eyes" and carry her off to sacrifice her to their cultish idol, Kang. More often than not they speak in broken English. It's about as blatant a collection of stereotypes as one might expect, and to top it off the leader of the Tong is a white guy disgusing himself as Chinese so he won't get the blame for the crimes of the Tong. I guess in some respects all the gangsters seen in the other stories are just as stereotypical, but there's a difference in calling on behavioral stereotypes in telling a story and calling on racial or cultural stereotypes, no matter how prevalent they may have been at the time.
We keep all the Robins, but not all the Flashes/Kid Flashes?
Here's the sheer facts:
More people care about Batman's history than the Flash's.
That's just the cold, hard truth. If DC eliminates, say, Tim Drake, they're going to catch a lot more flak than they are if they eliminate.....you see? I don't even know a Kid Flash, let alone multiples! If you asked me who Kid Flash was, I'd probably say Speedy, and then I'd remember that, nonsensically, Speedy was the name of Green Arrow's sidekick. I think. I'm not even sure now.
And I'm not saying it's right--you ask me, they should have off'd all the Robins out of existence, too, but Grant Morrison would pitch a goddamn fit if that happened.
BWprowl wrote:The internet having this many different words to describe nerdy folks is akin to the whole eskimos/ice situation, I would presume.
People spend so much time worrying about whether a figure is "mint" or not that they never stop to consider other flavours.
Most of the non-comic reading public have no clue that there have been multiple Robins. They think there's one, and if they even know his name, they think it's the original, Dick Grayson. It's the same situation we have with Batgirl. Most people have no clue that Stephanie Brown and Cassandra Cain existed. When they think of Batgirl, they think of Barbara Gordon. But comic readers are familiar with the multiple characters who have been Robin or the Flash or Blue Beetle, or whoever. Ask fans of Wally West (former Kid Flash, then the Flash for 22 years) how happy they are that he's gone. Personally, I'm actually happy he hasn't been imported into the New 52 and ruined like everyone else, but that's just me.
andersonh1 wrote:Most of the non-comic reading public have no clue that there have been multiple Robins.
I can attest to that. I remember when I found out who Nightwing was as a kid before I really got into reading comics, and then from that finding out who Jason Todd and Tim Drake are as a result.
Flash seems a bit different to me though. I remember knowing Wally West was the Flash before learning Barry Allen had been the Flash before him.
andersonh1 wrote:Most of the non-comic reading public have no clue that there have been multiple Robins.
I can attest to that. I remember when I found out who Nightwing was as a kid before I really got into reading comics, and then from that finding out who Jason Todd and Tim Drake are as a result.
One of my all-time favorite stories I've heard regarding this sort of thing: A teacher in an...English class, I think, was talking about 'A Death in the Family' and the call-in poll that led to Jason Todd being offed, and a girl stands up in the lecture hall and panickedly goes "They killed Robin?!". The teacher then reassures her, going on to say that this was like twenty years ago, that it was the second Robin, and he was later replaced with a different guy. The girl maintains her same demeanor as her next question is "There was more than one Robin?!"
All-American Comics #72, April 1946
Green Lantern – “Rumors of the Round Table”
After reading some 1940s Flash comics, I was interested to see what Green Lantern was like in the 40s as well. I’ve tracked down a few random issues here and there, and while it’s obviously hard to judge an entire series from just three or four examples, these Golden Age Green Lantern comics don’t seem all that different from Silver Age stories. They’re simple, whimsical and often (probably unintentionally) funny. There’s nothing quite as absurd as seeing the phrase “Green Lantern is felled by his deadliest enemy… wood!” . And we thought the color yellow was a lame weakness…
Alan Scott is the original Green Lantern of course. During his time there was no Green Lantern Corps, no Guardians of the Universe, and no Hal Jordan or Guy Gardner, or any of the other characters. None of that had been created yet. There was just Alan Scott, his magic ring and lantern, and his deliberately garish costume with the red shirt and purple cape. The character is earth-bound, not cosmic in nature, and the page one concept summary at the beginning of every story above the logo reads as follows:
“Take the mystic potency of an ancient Green Lamp – potency which enables a man to walk through walls and gives him immunity to metals for 24 hours after he has touched the Power Ring to the Green Lamp – combine it with the tremendous willpower of Alan Scott – and you have Green Lantern.”
I was also surprised in some of these stories to see Alan Scott using the same oath while charging his ring that Hal Jordan would use later on, though he doesn’t actually recite it in this particular story. Modern appearances by Scott have him using the older oath (“I shall cast my light over dark evil…”), but in the few stories I've read, Alan uses the familiar “In brightest day, in blackest night…” variation that is word for word identical to Jordan’s GL oath.
So, “Rumors of the Round Table” rips off... I mean, borrows ideas from Mark Twain’s “A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur’s Court” both in setup and concept. Alan Scott and his sidekick Doiby Dickles (the comic relief, if the name hadn’t clued you in) are visiting a museum, where they find a derby hat with an arrow in it. Of course, they both know exactly where it came from, and this leads into the story proper where Merlin (who is a fake magician, just like he is in Twain’s book) is casting spells to find help for King Arthur against a dragon, and is surprised when it actually works and Green Lantern appears. GL is of course, happy to help out, but the Knight Tarquin isn’t pleased and he attacks GL and Doiby. The fight is a short one as GL melts their armor and swords with his ring. He rarely makes constructs with his ring, something else I’ve noticed that sets him apart from later Green Lanterns. There are other fights, and of course the fights are filled with hijinks and quips rather than blood and gore. It’s all mildly amusing.
And of course, the dragon isn’t a dragon at all, but Roger Bacon, an actual 11th century scholar and friar. He’s experimenting with gunpowder, which the idiots in the valley mistook for a dragon in a cave. Problem solved, except that Alan’s ring has run out of power, leaving him stranded in medieval times. But in a time-wimey twist (foreshadowed by Arthur mentioning the Chinese embassy visiting his castle), the green lantern that Alan will own in the future is in the possession of the Chinese visiting the castle, and Alan is able to charge his ring and return home, remarking that he wishes he could understand the mysteries of the green lamp.
And that’s it… a weird mix of superhero, Mark Twain and celebrity historical. Lightweight nonsense that I enjoy largely because I enjoy the modern day Alan Scott (pre New 52 of course).
The more I read some of these Golden Age comics, the more I like them. Yeah, I've read some that were really poor, and the writing isn't all that sophisticated, but sometimes the sheer simplicity and fun goes a long way. And comparisons to modern day comics are always interesting to me.
Flash Comics #88, October 1947
“The Case of the Vanished Year!”
Geoff Johns recently stated that “The Flash is to time what Green Lantern is to space”. And indeed, Barry Allen’s attempt to time travel is what (in-story anyway) caused the whole Flashpoint/New 52 universes to come into existence, largely due to the reverse Flash messing with history and Allen trying to set it right. Allen rather famously used to use the “cosmic treadmill” to travel in time, apparently finding it difficult or impossible to do so on his own.
So with all of that in mind, it’s interesting to read and compare this Flash story from 1947 in which Jay Garrick can easily travel in time under his own power, with pretty accurate results. The story begins with Homer Brown, a scientist friend of Jay’s who knows a secret that he’s waiting to reveal to the authorities at the right time, when suddenly the world changes around him. His rented apartment is burned down, his worn out suit is brand new, and the ring that he pawned for money is back on his finger. Bewildered he wanders off.
Enter Jay, who learns his friend has vanished a month ago. He gets a letter written the day before Brown vanished, but is attacked by thugs who try to get away with the letter. Naturally Jay assumes his Flash identity, beats up the crooks and retrieves the letter, which details how Homer planned to reveal his secret at the scientific convention. Why he didn’t just go to the police, I don’t know. Thought he wouldn’t be believed, I’m guessing. Jay takes the evidence to Professor Garant, the president of the research society, who goes with Jay to Homer’s apartment to look for clues. While there, Garant pulls out a weapon and shoots Jay with it, and Jay finds himself in his lab, talking with Joan, feeling a sense of déjà vu as if he was reliving events.
So what does he do? Drink a chemical concoction he invented that hypnotizes him and releases his memories of course. After Joan tells Jay that the convention he was just visiting is a year off, Jay figures out that he’s been sent a year back in time to 1946. It appears that he’s reliving past events rather than two of him existing at the same time, but when he goes to find Brown (who is also repeating past actions), he says that the shock of time travel has destroyed their memories of the real present, and that the only way to recover their memories is to return to the present. Or, you know, bring some of that chemical formula for Brown, something like that, but I guess Jay didn’t think of that.
So Jay takes Brown, starts running and tells him “I’m going to raise my velocity to the speed of light. That’s the only way we may be able to get back to our own time.” That doesn’t work, so Jay has to run faster than the speed of light. Which is amusing since one of the modern retcons is that Jay could only top out at the speed of sound until he learned how to access the Speed Force like the other Flashes. Here he just casually exceeds lightspeed and arrives back in 1947 at exactly the time he left.
All of this takes us to the last few pages of the story where Garant, now calling himself Mr. X, is holding Keystone City hostage with what he thinks is his disintegrator ray, not realizing that his weapon sends people back in time by mistake. Gotta hate it when your super weapon goes wrong like that, right? Jay takes him out pretty fast, and the threat is ended, with Jay musing that they need to find a beneficial use for Garant’s discoveries. There’s nothing like some compact and to the point storytelling. A lot of ground is covered in 12 short pages, and a lot of concepts that should have major repercussions for the characters are just tools to tell the story, such as Jay’s “hypnotizing” formula or his ability to travel in time. It’s just one more example of the difference in writing styles between 1947 and 2013.
Maybe we need a "Retro comics that are not awesome thread". At least this one has some historical interest...
All-American Comics #96, April 1948
Green Lantern – “Mystery of the Emerald Necklace”
Okay, you know your time as a super hero is about up when you’re being upstaged by Streak, the Wonder Dog. And I thought Doiby was a comic sidekick…
So, Alan Scott has a new neighbor who he thinks he’s seen before, but he can’t quite remember where. Luckily for her, Alan’s dog Streak thinks he’d better keep an eye on her. Yeah, he’s thinking to himself in English and when he goes to check on her, and the letter she’s holding “has the scent of someone evil!” See, he has to smell it, because dogs can’t read. That would just be silly.
I’m not going to go through the entire “plot”, such as it is. Suffice to say that Green Lantern gets knocked unconscious twice, while Streak calls for help, trails the bad guys who kidnap the girl, saves GL and her from drowning (by turning off the water spigot no less), all the while thinking to himself about what GL would want him to do. It’s clear who the hero of this story is, and it’s not Green Lantern. The last panel of the story asks readers if they like Streak, and would like to see more, so it’s clear where this series was going. Straight to the dogs. Not even in the darkest depths of the slang-filled 70s was Hal Jordan subjected to indignities like this.
A little Google research reveals that the dog did in fact become the star feature of All-American as super heroes lost their appeal in the late 40s. It wasn’t long before Streak was appearing on the cover of Green Lantern, while GL himself was not. It makes me wonder if it wasn’t the concept of superheroes in general that was the problem, but rather stale writing and silly concepts like Streak. Though admittedly, he’s just Lassie rescuing Timmy… I mean, Green Lantern from the well.
