ROTF Review Thread

[Onslaught Six]

Massive pegwarmer here. I am slightly tempted to buy on the nature of being Real Gear-esque, but the video I've seen of him in the movie is super annoying. I was thinking if I see it for under $8, I'd buy. What's fun about it?

Well, this was in direct comparison to Rampage at the time, so. Plus, I actually liked him in the movie, so that may colour my judgement.

[donosaur]

Alright automen, what's the word on Voyager Starscream? The mentions in this thread point to him being average, and I'm on the fence. Is there anything I need to know that I can't tell from pictures?

[JediTricks]

Rampage has problems galore, but I think it was you, JT, who mentioned them being 'interesting' problems.

Yeah, I said something like that. How dare you use my words against me?

His failure is not that he doesn't try, and I can applaud that. He's certainly not polished, yet I find myself more forgiving than normal for a line so plagued with issues. Sigh. Maybe I'm lowering my average standards here, yet I've had more fun with Rampage than most of this line's supposed flagship toys.

You also like Demolishor though, and he's the epitome of pure suck. Rampage does indeed try, but the problem is WHAT he's trying and how far off the mark he lands.

Well, this was in direct comparison to Rampage at the time, so. Plus, I actually liked him in the movie, so that may colour my judgement.

Fine, qualifiers accepted, now answer the question.

Alright automen, what's the word on Voyager Starscream? The mentions in this thread point to him being average, and I'm on the fence. Is there anything I need to know that I can't tell from pictures?

For me, all I need to know is his damned hands stick out the back of the alt mode, and he's not the leader-class version coming at the end of next year which looks super awesome. They literally could have gotten my money though if they had hidden those hands, even with the guns not folding away like they promised on the box .

[onslaught86]

Alright automen, what's the word on Voyager Starscream? The mentions in this thread point to him being average, and I'm on the fence. Is there anything I need to know that I can't tell from pictures?

He's suck, avoid. Some nice ideas ruined by budget cuts, and the tattoos are ugly. If the Leader one's a bit big and 'spensive, see if you can get hold of the last MovieScream, he's a better toy.

Yeah, I said something like that. How dare you use my words against me?

I wasn't using them against you per se, just don't think he's the total loss O6 feels him to be. It was, in part, your comments that convinced me he was worth buying.

Terrible representation of the movie model, but the movie model's horrid anyway, bizarre robot eel. Very glad for that, quadroped is vastly more interesting, definitely a case of the toy being better than the concept. Would've made a much more exciting Mega, then they'd have had the scope and budget to do him justice. Given I'd written him off completely before you and Prowl talked the ideas behind the figure up, I'm amazed I like him as much as I do.

He's a neat design, the four legs with weapon arms is very BW Scarem and Zerg Ultralisk, and it's not something you'd expect to get from a bulldozer. His head's cute, and I like the articulation it has, goes a long way toward giving him character. Detail level is good as well, he's busy without being lost in his aesthetic.

On the flipside, the colours are boring, the articulation's poor (Although I really think more joints would've hindered him further instead of helping), there are tolerance issues, the jackhammer mode's a neat concept with bad execution that hurts the other modes, he doesn't peg together solidly and relies on small slots, the pistons don't lock down in any mode but jackhammer, the vehicle mode falls apart and the blade doesn't raise, his rear legs would've been much better with the pistons, his front legs are poorly integrated and should look more like the back ones, the joined hip axle is horrible, his whips don't stow without locking his arms to his sides, his lightpiping's crap, and there are lots of exposed screws.

It's certainly not for a lack of appreciation of his flaws that I like him, on the contrary. He tried something different. May not have gotten there, but damnit, he tried, heh. The toy encourages me to fiddle with it - I've found myself constantly reposing his four-legged form, tilting the head to one side or the other, and arranging the treads in his hands in different ways. He's both visually and tactilely stimulating in ways many of the other toys in the line are not. Flagship figures like Prime and Starscream have been shelved and all but forgotten, yet Rampage gets pride of place next to my computer because I can't stop messing with him.

You also like Demolishor though, and he's the epitome of pure suck.

Sure, in that he's not a regular TF with real arms and legs. He doesn't try to be that, though. I got both him and Rampage for 30% off the retail price, so I feel less ripped than I would if I'd paid full. Breakaway I also got for 30% off, and he's worlds of awful.
Demolishor I can't blame for being what he is, they did the best they could to make a fun toy out of the bizarre concept, and a fun toy he is. I have concerns about durability, as mine already has loose joints and some stress marks, he's pretty hard to keep standing even without that. It's one of those ones you'll either like or hate, it grew on me enough to justify a sale price. O6 likes Demmy a bit more than I do.

[Onslaught Six]

[quote="JediTricks]Fine, qualifiers accepted, now answer the question.[/quote]

I dunno. I fiddled with him and he didn't immediately suck? You got me.

It's one of those ones you'll either like or hate, it grew on me enough to justify a sale price. O6 likes Demmy a bit more than I do.

Technically, my Demmy was $18 (as was Mixmaster) which is a full $4-$5 less than his usual price. Mind, still only two below what Megas 'used' to be, but money saved is money saved.

I do like him more, especially with the arms swapped. But I like Mixmaster more than Demmy, definitely. Demmy is an interesting play on a flawed design, while Mixmaster's only flaws are kibble.

[SynjoDeonecros]

Here's a RotF Ravage review from me:


Robot Mode
I'll get this out of the way, first: I hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, HATE, HATE, HATE, HATE what Michael Bay did to the designs of Ravage, and all the other Transformers by extension. They always reminded me of a 72-car pile up sent through a heavy-duty industrial metal shredder and blast-welded into a vaguely humanoid shape, but Ravage takes the cake; it's like Mr. Bay bred a Xenomorph with Zuul from Ghostbusters after borrowing Dr. Robotnik's roboticizer for the weekend. The fact that he's got an ungodly love for silver robots, and thus Ravage was all silver in the movie depiction, didn't help much, either. When the first pics of the toy came out, I was hopeful but still skeptical, and frankly, that skepticism is well-founded.

Fist of all, Ravage isn't silver in this version. Seriously, except for his Shattered Glass counterpart, Ravage, regardless of which continuity he's in, is a BLACK JAGUAR; it's one of his most distinguishing marks, the black-with-silver-highlights color scheme, so seeing Hasbro give it to the movie figure instead of keeping it movie-accurate is a relief. In this regard, I actually praise the toy; the figure is mostly black, with silverish gray on its legs and back spines (which are all soft plastic), which is how it should be. Interestingly, though, Hasbro did one better, giving the character cobalt blue highlights along the upper torso, as well, and it fits in very nicely with the rest of the colors; it's subtle enough to not be glaringly neon against the rest of the figure, but it's bright enough to make the details of the areas it's coloring pop. The only thing I don't like is the eye; it and the entire top of the head is a translucent grape Jolly Rancher purple, most likely for light piping. Unfortunately, not only have I not gotten it to work, the coloring clashes horribly with the rest of the figure, which is a minus. Oh, and for all of you who hate Bay's overuse of silver faction symbols, never fear; Ravage's is in the same purple (though curiously located on his ass. Don't ask me why there).

The joints, while many and give the figure lots of posability, are very inconsistent in their tightness and tend to appear (or not appear) in odd places. For instance, along with the four normal joints on the tail, there's a pivot point right next to the joint second closest to the ass area, which is very fragile and likes to pop off with anything more than light pressure. This joint is never mentioned in the instructions, which sucks because it looks essential to positioning the tail correctly when transforming it into its "alt" mode. The waist joint is very loose, causing the upper body to flop around and twist at odd angles. It gets really annoying when I'm trying to transform it. Seriously, why is it even there? Or, at the very least, why is it on such a loose ball joint? The legs are just as stiff as the waist is loose and the tail is breakable, especially in the feet, meaning you're forced to apply some rough pressure on some very sharp edges. Not a good design, people. Plus, the elbows have hinge that move the forearms out away from the body, but only a little, since a tiny block of plastic molded into the joint keeps it from moving out too far. The movement is barely noticeable, and it doesn't contribute anything to the figure's posability or transformation, so why is it there?

As someone on here mentioned elsewhere, Ravage has no neck joint; instead, he has a gimmick similar to that of Universe Cheetor, where you pull on a switch on his back to make his head lunge forward in a biting movement. This, I've got to say, is pointless; the mouth doesn't close all the way in its "start" position, and it's so loose on a pin hinge, it just flops open. The "ears" move back, as well, but that only makes you realize that the figure looks better with the ears back. It would've been better had they just extended the neck, molded the ears back, and put proper joints in the jaw and neck.

"Alt" Mode
As has been mentioned several times before, Ravage's "alt" mode isn't; it's just Ravage folded up with its chest spread out to deploy "wings", wigs that - ironically - can be used, somewhat, in robot mode. I have to say, I've never gotten on board with Bay's thinking about why the Transformers flew through space in spaceships instead of by themselves; I can think of a multitude of reasons for that (fuel issues, most of the Transformers would already have alt modes, by then, can get more 'bots to their destination if they carpool, etc), so the whole "comet" thing just seemed stupid to me. And it really does look like they just slapped it together at the last moment, since it's clear they didn't know WHAT the hell Ravage turned into; I've not seen the movie, myself, but I have seen the part where Ravage gets deployed, and not only do we get a very far-away and fuzzy shot of his "alt" mode, but we don't even see him transform, so really, what CAN he transform into?

Unfortunately, the same joint tightness inconsistency plagues this mode, too; the pivots for the chest area and back legs are very loose, and when in metal log from space mode, only slight pressure is needed to shift everything out of alignment and make the entire transformation fall apart. Also, like I said, the pivot on the tail is obviously meant to turn it around and make it fit correctly in the alt mode, as not doing so makes the tail curve down away from the figure, breaking the transformation and making it hard to display; plus, it makes Ravage look like one of his two parents had stallion DNA in them. Also, as I said before, this pivot is NEVER MENTIONED in the instruction manual, which is a really dumb move when the tail doesn't curve the way it looks in the instructions normally. I highly recommend NOT transforming him into this mode, at all; you'll only suffer pain from it.

For kicks, I tried the "Killer Robot Chocobo" form that appeared a while back, and weirdly, it looks rather good; true, it's only Ravage's "alt" mode with the back legs folded down to act as chicken legs while the front legs are slung over its back, but at least it looks better and resembles SOMETHING, unlike the real "alt" mode. The same "gently tap it and it all falls to hell" problem with the joints in the official "alt" mode apply here, but they're less noticeable, probably because the way the front legs are positioned keep the chest halves in place better. If they had found a way to make the wings pull out to become bigger, and pain them red, Hasbro could've had a legitimate reason to give us an unofficial RotF Laserbeak.

Overview
All in all, this is not a good toy; the alt mode is nonexistent, the figure is unstable, and despite the nifty coloring scheme, it's still the ass-ugly wreckage it was in the movies. I'm only keeping it because A) my mate gave it to me as a present, B)the color scheme DOES redeem it just enough to make it Ravage (if not a good Ravage), and C) we have serious fun making fun of it when in "chocobo" mode. I'd seriously give this one a pass; there are far better Ravage figures out there, even for a die-hard fan like me, to waste their time and money on it.

[BWprowl]

Alright automen, what's the word on Voyager Starscream? The mentions in this thread point to him being average, and I'm on the fence. Is there anything I need to know that I can't tell from pictures?

I'll go the opposite of '86 and reccommend this one. Now granted, I actually *like* the tattoos (I like them a lot, actually), so he pleases me aesthetically. The more streamlined jet mode (compared to the original) helps too (though as JT mentioned, the hands sticking out the back is a serious visual issue). Transformation is complex, yet intuitive. Some very clever things going on here, especially the way the hinges wrap around the tailfins to become the chest; don't think I've ever seen that before. Robot mode is nice. Hurt mostly by arm articulation that is, simply put, backwards. If his elbows bent inward and his hands outward, then he'd be fantastic, but it's the other way around and that sucks. Still looks great though, and he's still plenty dynamic. Plus, he gets extra points from me since I've been a big Movie Starscream fan since "Reign of Starscream". Really, your opinion of that toy will depend heavily on your appreciation for the character, how much you like the look, and your opinion of super-complex transformations.

Y'know, toys have always been a fairly subjective medium, but am I the only one noticing that the ROTF toys in particular seem to be *really* subjective in terms of quality? One guy's awesome idea is another guy's poorly-executed junk. Hell, DvD's review of Demolishor says this much in regards to the man's reccommendation of that toy.

[Onslaught Six]

It also depends on if you're crazy enough to wait a year for LeaderScream.

[JediTricks]

Yeah, I said something like that. How dare you use my words against me?

I wasn't using them against you per se, just don't think he's the total loss O6 feels him to be. It was, in part, your comments that convinced me he was worth buying.

You're not the only one to suggest that. And I kinda see it, but then I mess with the figure again and remember what a miserable toy it really is. So many folks out there are willing to put up with crazy bullshit to find their own way in this toy, I guess.

Terrible representation of the movie model, but the movie model's horrid anyway, bizarre robot eel. Very glad for that, quadroped is vastly more interesting, definitely a case of the toy being better than the concept. Would've made a much more exciting Mega, then they'd have had the scope and budget to do him justice. Given I'd written him off completely before you and Prowl talked the ideas behind the figure up, I'm amazed I like him as much as I do.

He's a neat design, the four legs with weapon arms is very BW Scarem and Zerg Ultralisk, and it's not something you'd expect to get from a bulldozer. His head's cute, and I like the articulation it has, goes a long way toward giving him character. Detail level is good as well, he's busy without being lost in his aesthetic.

On the flipside, the colours are boring, the articulation's poor (Although I really think more joints would've hindered him further instead of helping), there are tolerance issues, the jackhammer mode's a neat concept with bad execution that hurts the other modes, he doesn't peg together solidly and relies on small slots, the pistons don't lock down in any mode but jackhammer, the vehicle mode falls apart and the blade doesn't raise, his rear legs would've been much better with the pistons, his front legs are poorly integrated and should look more like the back ones, the joined hip axle is horrible, his whips don't stow without locking his arms to his sides, his lightpiping's crap, and there are lots of exposed screws.

I love the glowing comments and then the MASSIVE PILE of problems afterwards.

It's certainly not for a lack of appreciation of his flaws that I like him, on the contrary. He tried something different. May not have gotten there, but damnit, he tried, heh. The toy encourages me to fiddle with it - I've found myself constantly reposing his four-legged form, tilting the head to one side or the other, and arranging the treads in his hands in different ways. He's both visually and tactilely stimulating in ways many of the other toys in the line are not. Flagship figures like Prime and Starscream have been shelved and all but forgotten, yet Rampage gets pride of place next to my computer because I can't stop messing with him.

The funny thing is, I don't think he really is trying anything different, he's a pretty standard bot when you really look at what you end up with. If he had feet, he'd be literally any old deluxe figure with too much backpack, but by removing the feet he needs the backpack to prop him up and pretend to be legs. It's a fakeout of cleverness, pretending to be more than it is when in reality it's less than.

I'm still tempted by Leader Prime and Voyager Screamer too, that's awesome, it's like you're living on the opposite side of the planet... oh wait, you are!

You also like Demolishor though, and he's the epitome of pure suck.

Sure, in that he's not a regular TF with real arms and legs.

And also in that he sucks and is small and has too few parts and has a lazy transformation and is a meaningless nothing of a bot mode.

He doesn't try to be that, though.

Boy is that true!

I got both him and Rampage for 30% off the retail price, so I feel less ripped than I would if I'd paid full. Breakaway I also got for 30% off, and he's worlds of awful.

Oh fuck, you got them on discount and Breakaway still sucks that bad? Damn, I want his repaint but now... wow.

Demolishor I can't blame for being what he is, they did the best they could to make a fun toy out of the bizarre concept, and a fun toy he is. I have concerns about durability, as mine already has loose joints and some stress marks, he's pretty hard to keep standing even without that. It's one of those ones you'll either like or hate, it grew on me enough to justify a sale price. O6 likes Demmy a bit more than I do.

I just don't see where they made a fun toy out of what he is. The alt mode is small and somewhat static, although it does have good detail. The transformation is every part just globbing around to be in less-than status. The robot mode is nothing, and while it's an accurate nothing, it's also a fairly inconsequential nothing, kinda small and simple for a Voyager, he's basically arms and a head, not much is going on. When I messed with it at Botcon, I couldn't believe they were actually releasing something so underwhelming for $22 US.

[Y'know, toys have always been a fairly subjective medium, but am I the only one noticing that the ROTF toys in particular seem to be *really* subjective in terms of quality? One guy's awesome idea is another guy's poorly-executed junk. Hell, DvD's review of Demolishor says this much in regards to the man's reccommendation of that toy.

Good point, but I think DvD's point actually takes it one step further, showing that even when a toy tickles one's fancy, it can still be flawed enough that it's probably going to fail the larger collecting groups. I feel like ROTF as a toy line is a failure, there are so many toys out there that aren't fun for kids and aren't really that great for collectors, that it takes fetishization of a specific aspect of the toy to deliver any positive results on the larger stage. If I were to look at my meager collection of ROTF and point to ones that would have universe collector appeal (sorry kids, there's nothing for you here in this line, I'm stating it right now), it'd be:
Ransack
Depthcharge
Sideways
Sideswipe (and even that is hampered by QC luck)

I can't speak to LC Optimus, and I won't dignify M1 repaints. But that's a HORRIBLE list of figures considering the sheer number of products out right now. And I'm looking forward to a very small number, half of which are repaints for god's sake! Dlx Dead End, blue scout Dead End (I forget the figure's actual name), Blazemaster, Thrust, Dune Runner, Ejector, voyager Long Haul, and the HA line. That's it for '09! That's horrible!

[Onslaught Six]

Yeah, but how much else is actually coming out in '09 that we currently know about?

I paid $18 for Demmy in a load of other toys. I swapped his forearms around and that really 'does' make him a lot better, to me--he looks like a big crazy wheel gorilla. And he's really variable, you can do a lot of different things with his wheels and treads and the like. It's certainly not ROTF's best figure, but he's there, and I like him a fair bit. (Plus, I figure I'll just get all the Constructicons they release--I only need Long Haul and I have four.)

Rampage has grown on me--I did one of the upper arm mods (but not the elbow mod) which helps a little bit, but not a whole lot. He's definitely not as cruddy as I first though him to be, but he's still not wonderful. I'd tell someone to get Skids or Mudflap first.