TF Views

BWprowl wrote:

Shockwave wrote:Well it's not really about "identifying" with the character as much as it is about having it be "believeable".

Oh sweet, this means I get to call you out for thinking Spider-Man is "believable", a favorite shtick of mine. Sorry in advance!

Lol, it's all good, I saw this coming While I was typing that I was actually thinking to myself: "I just know Prowl's gonna get me for this".

Yeah, like Sparky said, I would argue that since he failed at the practical stuff, he doesn't actually do all of that which is probably why at least 2 of the three girlfriends are now exes and Jameson fires him all the time. I will agree with you on the rent though, I always make sure my house payment is made on time each month.

Shockwave
-Spends no money on spandex oweing to the fact that I do not have the privelage to wear it.

Peter also bagged a supermodel. Yeah, we can all identify with that.

Dom
-even Peter's failures are actually pretty good.

Onslaught Six wrote:Wasn't there a minor plot point in the second film where Doc Ock (pre-mecharms) was lecturing Peter for doing horribly in his classes? I may just be thinking about the game.

Both Dr. Connors and Octavius mentioned Peter's falling grades. It's been a while since I've seen that movie, but as I remember it remember the reason Connors set up Peter to talk to Doc Ock in the first place was for an extra credit assignment to help bring his grade up. And Doc Ock called him "Brilliant but lazy".

Spider-Man isn't realistic. College doesn't have gym.

The college I went to had several gym courses actually. Though it wasn't a requirement of my college to take a gym credit to graduate. Wouldn't surprise me if they used to though. Keep in mind Peter when was in college, starting in the late 60's and graduating in 1978. College requirements have changed a lot since then.

Dominic wrote:All things considered, Peter did amazingly well.

He did alright, I wouldn't say he did "amazingly well" though. As I said, he didn't always manage to do that great juggling everything in his life, often succeeding in one area but failing in another.

Shockwave wrote:I will agree with you on the rent though

Speaking of which... "The Saga of the Alien Costume" I got shows Peter's landlady was always bugging Peter about the rent. And I remember seeing a cover in which Peter and MJ were evicted from their apartment during Christmas.

Sure, Spider-Man's not realistic. There is no way a dude could do all of that. But I can kinda identify with all the crap Peter has to deal with. Not those specific issues, mind you, but the fact that dude has entirely too much on his plate.

Something I always kind of like in the comics, too, is that no matter how what Spider-Man does, the general public is generally about half-convinced that he's a threat and/or a menace. See, most superheroes don't have to put up with that kind of crap. Again, maybe not realistic, but hell, who doesn't sometimes feel like no matter what they do, nobody's gonna give a rat's ass? I had absolutely no problem with that changing in the movies, though. Poor guy deserved a break.

I think for me part of it's the fact that I'm changing. I have a much practical approach to just about everything than I did even a few years ago. Whereas before I liked Superman for being such fantastical escapism, I now see it as a flaw. And this isn't just limited to comics. I often wonder what most of my fave sci-fi/fantasy characters would do if they had the same crap to deal with that I do. Which is usually stuff that super powers would be useless to deal with. Spidey obviously gets a little closer to that while still being 90% fantasy escapism. Shows like Family Guy and Robot Chicken that frequently show fictional pop culture characters having to deal with day-to-day practical stuff.

I do not tend to read for escapism in the first place. (That is what sleep is for if nothing else.)

Most supers would not have to deal with the things that we do. That is the point of being a super. Spiderman's skill-set and intelligence, (not presented as superhuman), would let him do far better for himself than working as a free-lance photographer. (The fact he still works that job is possibly one of the least realisitic things in comics.) He spider-powers would be useful in any number of fields.

Superman's power set would insulate him from most any mortal concerns.

The question of what a given character would do in my place is not even applicable, as my situation would change by virtue of introducting super-powers into the equation.

Dominic wrote: Most supers would not have to deal with the things that we do. That is the point of being a super. Spiderman's skill-set and intelligence, (not presented as superhuman), would let him do far better for himself than working as a free-lance photographer.

Yeah, but the demands of his Spider-Man lifestyle make the freelance photographer thing work out better for him than most other jobs would. Look at when he was a teacher for awhile, all of the time he was having trouble with the making it in late because some supervillain or other would slow him down on the way to work.

Of course, you'd think he could just sell his web formula to 3M or Tony Stark and not worry about working anymore, but whatever, he's got his reasons, and they more or less make sense.

How marketable would the web fluid be though? If Stark or some other firm wanted to make it, the science of 616 Marvel would allow them to do so easily. Web-shooters would be common, or at least easy to manufacture.

Parker could get research grants that would let him work on his own time, so long as delivered results. Being a teacher was, while not a terrible idea, still a short-sell for Spidey.

Dom
all hail the artificial status quo.

Found another interesting article on this, but talking about video games--at least partially, since the man is a game reviewer and all.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/article ... ion-Kratos

I like what Croshaw is shooting for, but his example might be flawed.

Kratos does play into the same childish idea of needing an audience ID character. It is a question of the audience. One of the audiences "God of War" is pitched to is......adolescent boys and adults who think like.....you guessed it, adolescent boys. Look at Kratos' origin and general concept. If you are ~14, then...oh yeah!

There might actually be something to the idea that audiences generally need a nice guy to identify with. There is proven acceptance of, if not demand for, that character type. This may not always lead to good writing, (as Croshaw points out), but it is marketable.

We actually see the same problem with real life. "Who are the good guys?"

Dom