TF Views

About that plausibility thing: http://collider.com/butch-cassidy-the-s ... ist/20638/

Point is, the more "Maybe he did this!" and "Maybe this happened!" bits you have to throw in that are entirely unexplained and unaccounted for in the original series, the more it stretches credibility.

And I think that's part of the thing--we're stretching all these things to fit into a series that a lot of us already are sick of seeing. Honestly, the reason I've stopped arguing so much for Car Robots to be accepted by many as canon in the BW era is because of my growing tiredness and distaste for that show and its setting. And that's the thing--I'm sick of the WE'RE ON PREHISTORIC EARTH HURR DURR setting. The only reason BW was even in that setting in the first place--I am not shitting, the ONLY single reason--was so that it would be kind of plausible for Megatron, Dinobot and Terrorsaur to turn into dinosaurs. And really, they weren't using those altmodes for disguise in the first place, so it clearly was not fucking important. (And don't throw some shit about how Bob 'n' Larry were thinking of Agenda in Season 1 because if they were, Agenda would have happened in Season 1.)

It's like somebody said, "Oh, well, they need to disguise themselves around dinosaurs. Let's set them on prehistoric Earth." And someone else said, "Well wait, if they're on prehistoric Earth, there's no humans to disguise themselves from, and also guys like Waspinator are giant wasps, so why even scan altmodes?" "Uh. Energon radiation. Beast modes protect them." "Oh, okay." And then they completely forgot they set it on prehistoric Earth to make those altmodes plausible. If Energon radiation or whatever was the whole reason they needed beast modes, would there be any reason the show couldn't be set in modern 1996-era Earth? (Besides Mainframe sucking at animation.)

So because of a budget/capability decision and some dumb story stuff, now everything related to BW has to be confined to this one setting and this one story. Everything has to be tied to this. It's freaking annoying. It'd be like if every depiction of vehicle TFs had to involve them landing on Earth four million years ago and waking up in 1984--RID didn't do that. Armada didn't do that. Cybertron didn't do that. The movie didn't do that. Animated didn't do that. But every BW story has to be focused on this one cartoon. That sucks. That's stupid.

Onslaught Six wrote:But every BW story has to be focused on this one cartoon. That sucks. That's stupid.

I liked the BW show, but I agree.

One vote over here for a BW story set in the toys' original continuity. The ORIGINAL continuity. Yeah, you know what I mean.

If The Gathering had been set in the modern day it would already be 4x better.

Shockwave wrote:Well I've highlighted at least five instances of either "would have", "could have" or variants there of and I was being pretty generous, there's actually more. But I guess my point is that Plausible is fine but after a certain point, it just reaches too absurd a level to be regarded as anything other than bullshit. I guess the BW comic just asked me to take too much on faith that it went past my bullshitometer. It's like Furman was saying "ok, if these five exact conditions were exactly right then here's what happened". Sorry, not buying it. So for me, between the terminal bullshitocity and the lack of events using the characters I actually liked, it was just too much epic fail for me.

Again, most of those are hypothetical 'had Magmatron's plans worked' comments. Those aren't something that actually happened in comic's story, so obviously those are something that only "could have" been. And the only other comment you highlighted there was from what Bob 'n' Larry had planned from the cartoon, which left open the "possibility" they could always introduce a stray stasis pod if they needed to. Which, again, I don't see how it's the comic's fault for using an open ended thread from the show.

Onslaught Six wrote:The only reason BW was even in that setting in the first place--I am not shitting, the ONLY single reason--was so that it would be kind of plausible for Megatron, Dinobot and Terrorsaur to turn into dinosaurs.

.... They scanned fossils to get their alt modes. That wasn't a reason for them to set the story on prehistoric Earth at all.

RID didn't do that. Armada didn't do that. Cybertron didn't do that. The movie didn't do that. Animated didn't do that.

Technically.... RID had Scourge's crew stuck in stasis on their ship for who knows how long. Armada had the Mini-Cons on Earth for millions of years stuck inside their panels until the kids activated them, altering Cybertron to their location. Cybertron also had established Atlantis was a Cybertronian ship that had been on Earth for millions of years, it's crew the inspiration for monster stories. The movie had Megatron frozen in ice for a long time until he was released by Frenzy. Not to mention several Seekers like Jetfire have just been sitting around the planet for apparently millions of years. And Animated had the Autobots in stasis after they crashed for 50 years. So yeah, it is actually something Transformers reuses a lot...

Gomess wrote:If The Gathering had been set in the modern day it would already be 4x better.

There is no guarantee of that...

If The Gathering had been set in the modern day it would already be 4x better.

Nah, it still would have suffered for Furman's complete lack of ideas.

As I've said, I thought it had some great ideas but some bad execution.

If the basic idea is good, a bad execution is that much worse.

The problem with Gathering/Ascending is that Furman is basically telling us that not only is all of the unlikely stuff plausible but that's what actually happened. He's asking us to take a lot of faith and frankly, I ain't buying it.

It is also a question of Furman making all of that stuff happen....for no reason other than to have more Beast Wars guys running around.

I could forgive Costa bringing back Sunstreaker, but because it looks like he planned to do something with Sunstreaker (a character who changed) and Ironhide (a character who changed little, and still managed to lose ground).

Shockwave, let me say I'm genuinely thankful for your repeated assertion that watching anime is somehow an awesome thing to do. That amuses me quite a bit, and makes me feel just a bit better.

Why not just hide your hobby at work, (if you think it will be a legit obstacle), but indulge in the after hours? If somebody does not like it, smash a beer bottle in their face.

So yeah, it is actually something Transformers reuses a lot...

O6 is saying that they do not constantly re-use '"Autobots and Decepticons crash at the same time on the same ship...."


Dom
-and, BW brought in the furries.

Sparky Prime wrote:

Shockwave wrote:Well I've highlighted at least five instances of either "would have", "could have" or variants there of and I was being pretty generous, there's actually more. But I guess my point is that Plausible is fine but after a certain point, it just reaches too absurd a level to be regarded as anything other than bullshit. I guess the BW comic just asked me to take too much on faith that it went past my bullshitometer. It's like Furman was saying "ok, if these five exact conditions were exactly right then here's what happened". Sorry, not buying it. So for me, between the terminal bullshitocity and the lack of events using the characters I actually liked, it was just too much epic fail for me.

Again, most of those are hypothetical 'had Magmatron's plans worked' comments. Those aren't something that actually happened in comic's story, so obviously those are something that only "could have" been. And the only other comment you highlighted there was from what Bob 'n' Larry had planned from the cartoon, which left open the "possibility" they could always introduce a stray stasis pod if they needed to. Which, again, I don't see how it's the comic's fault for using an open ended thread from the show.

Like I said, it was just too much supposition for me that it went past my bullshitometer. Yours apparently has a higher tolerance than mine.

Sparky Prime wrote:

Onslaught Six wrote:The only reason BW was even in that setting in the first place--I am not shitting, the ONLY single reason--was so that it would be kind of plausible for Megatron, Dinobot and Terrorsaur to turn into dinosaurs.

.... They scanned fossils to get their alt modes. That wasn't a reason for them to set the story on prehistoric Earth at all.

I don't think O6 was talking about the in context reason for it, he was talking about why the writers chose that setting. We KNOW they scanned fossils, no one here is debating otherwise.

Sparky Prime wrote:

RID didn't do that. Armada didn't do that. Cybertron didn't do that. The movie didn't do that. Animated didn't do that.

Technically.... RID had Scourge's crew stuck in stasis on their ship for who knows how long. Armada had the Mini-Cons on Earth for millions of years stuck inside their panels until the kids activated them, altering Cybertron to their location. Cybertron also had established Atlantis was a Cybertronian ship that had been on Earth for millions of years, it's crew the inspiration for monster stories. The movie had Megatron frozen in ice for a long time until he was released by Frenzy. Not to mention several Seekers like Jetfire have just been sitting around the planet for apparently millions of years. And Animated had the Autobots in stasis after they crashed for 50 years. So yeah, it is actually something Transformers reuses a lot...

Again, I think you missed O6's point (I'll obviously leave to O6 to correct me if I'm wrong, but here's what I think he meant): It's not that there haven't been "Transformers on Earth for millions of years" it's that none of those series had "woke up in 1984 and took only '84 alt modes". Or worse, "went back to 1984 when G1 happened but couldn't interact with any of those characters".

Sparky Prime wrote:

Gomess wrote:If The Gathering had been set in the modern day it would already be 4x better.

There is no guarantee of that...

Eh. The premise would have been better at least. It's still Furman phoning it in though so Sparky's right it might not have actually been better.

Dominic wrote:

Shockwave, let me say I'm genuinely thankful for your repeated assertion that watching anime is somehow an awesome thing to do. That amuses me quite a bit, and makes me feel just a bit better.

Why not just hide your hobby at work, (if you think it will be a legit obstacle), but indulge in the after hours? If somebody does not like it, smash a beer bottle in their face.

Well at work is another thing. I've been fortunate to work places where my hobby hasn't hindered my reputation, but I know there are places that it could be a detriment. For example, I would not want to work in my mom's office and have everyone there know about my hobby. It's not so much that I would care what people think so much as it would be a tactical decision not to hurt my chances for advancement. Now, once I was up to being a manager or having the position of power in the office it would be on like Donkey Kong.

Shockwave wrote:

Sparky Prime wrote:

Gomess wrote:If The Gathering had been set in the modern day it would already be 4x better.

There is no guarantee of that...

Eh. The premise would have been better at least. It's still Furman phoning it in though so Sparky's right it might not have actually been better.

Setting it in the late 90s would've necessitated SOME wider contextualising. Involving human culture in even the most rudimentary fashion. I'm familiar enough with Furman's work to know that he loves juxtaposing human and TF behaviour. You guys noticed that, right? He loves that shizzle. So, yeah, I stand by my assertion. If the order had come down from on high, "WRITE A BEAST WARS MINI ABOUT THE JAPANESE TOYS IN THE MODERN WORLD~" Furman couldn't have resisted doing a better job. Only slightly better, maybe, but the prehistoric context *really* hurts The Gathering in my opinion. Maybe more than anything else.

Eh, I'm a guy with faith, what can I say?

Dominic wrote:
Dom
-and, BW brought in the furries.

Says the man who enjoys My Little Pony.