TF Views

So, I saw Spider-Man Far From Home on opening day.

Spoiler

The movie spends a some time touching upon "the blip", which is what people have taken to calling the snap from Infinity War. Aunt May runs a volunteer organization that helps people affected by the blip, which is funded by Stark Enterprises, and Spider-Man helps out by making public appearances. Feeling pressured by the loss of Tony Stark though, Peter is looking forward to taking a vacation with his class where he can just be a normal kid for a while.

If you've seen the trailers, you already know the vacation gets derailed when Nick Fury enlists Spider-Man's help, teaming him up with Mysterio, to deal with 'elementals'. But this is all a ruse so that Mysterio can get his hands on a piece of tech Tony Stark left to Peter when he died, which he, and several ex-Stark employees were not happy about. Realizing his mistake, Spider-Man has to stop Mysterio from destroying London and killing his classmates.

After saving the day, Spidey's victory is short lived, as JJJ (played once again by JK Simmons) goes public with (faked) footage of Spider-Man ordering the attack on London, and reveals Spider-Man's identity. And it turns out Nick Fury and Agent Hill were Skrulls during the whole film.

Overall, I really enjoyed the film, working as a follow-up to Endgame, and setting things up for the future, all the while telling its own story.

Looks like Spider-Man might be leaving the MCU.... With Far From Home concluding the contracted 5 films between Sony and Disney, the two companies once again have to sit down to negotiate if they will continue to work together... or if Sony will take Spidey back, cutting him off from the MCU.

One of the big points is money. Under the original deal, Sony was getting the vast majority of the profits from the Box Office and now Disney reportedly is trying to renegotiate an even split, 50/50, and Sony doesn't want to give up this sweat deal they got. Edit: Apparently the proposal was actually for a 30/70 split of the box office profits, with Sony getting the 70, and in exchange, Disney would co-finance the films.

The article I linked to also claims that negotiations are still taking place however, and that a representative from Sony believes the dispute is over a producer credit. Supposedly being Kevin Feige, which Deadline reports via a Sony representative, that it was Disney's decision to remove Feige as lead producer from future live-action Spider-Man films so that he can focus on "many new responsibilities", such as developing other recently acquired Marvel properties, and doesn't have time for IP Disney doesn't own. Which sounds like BS if you ask me, with how hard Disney has fought to be able to use Spider-Man in the MCU, and has positioned the character to play an important role moving forward. Not to mention, Marvel has said several times, they don't have any immediate plans for the X-Men and Fantastic Four.

I'm really hoping they do still come to a deal. I'd hate to see Sony run Spider-Man straight into the ground a third time while denying Spidey from appearing in the MCU again, after the character has flourished being a part of that universe.

I think it would be in everyone's best interests for Sony and Disney to continue working together on these movies. Both have clearly benefited from the deal, and I don't know that audiences have the patience for yet another reboot of the franchise.

I saw Spider-Man Far From Home, it left me a little cold. I gave it a 6/10. With Disney wanting a larger stake in the films and pulling out until they get it (as getting just 5% of the opening day grosses isn't enough for what they're bringing to the table; this film through Disney's efforts has become Sony's highest-grossing film of all time), Sony is left with a Spider-Man that won't work the way they do things, and Disney is left with egg on their face having created an all-new theme park ride at 2 of their parks based around a property they can't use movie marketing to push anymore. Everyone loses!

andersonh1 wrote:A movie I used to enjoy but which has absolutely not held up well is Batman Forever. I tried watching it over the weekend, having not seen it in years, but it's just one cringe inducing scene after another, particularly once Jim Carrey turns up. Val Kilmer is not bad as either Bruce Wayne or Batman (though given the overacting by Tommy Lee Jones and Carrey, he's so laid back he almost feels invisible), and I like the material with Chris O'Donnell and particularly Micheal Gough (who is pure class in all the Batman movies where he appears), but it makes this movie schizophrenic. Some heartfelt storylines about family and identity are stuck in the same movie with ridiculous hammy villains who are as over the top as it's humanly possible to be. Nicole Kidman is in the movie to be eye candy and little more.

When I watch the Adam West Batman series, I'm entertained by and greatly enjoy the scenery chewing villains, but they just can't pull off the same thing in Batman Forever, though they were clearly trying to as a reaction against the tone of Batman Forever. Jim Carrey will never be Frank Gorshin. I used to think Batman and Robin was where these movies went bad, but I'm not sure any of them were ever all that good to begin with, and things certainly took a downhill turn with Forever.

OH MY GOD IT'S BOILING ACID!

This movie's failure is 100% the studio's fault. They forced a new director after Batman Returns was such a mess and didn't make sure that director knew or cared about the material (he only knew the campy '60s tv show) then they told him it had to be dark like the last one but fun for kids and had to sell toys and it had to have Jim Carrey who is just the worst thing in it. Carrey never for a second shows a modicum of concern for the character he's playing, he's just doing schtick after schtick after schtick, he throws the tone into disarray and he not once creates a believable tone of menace.

The '89 Batman is a tour de force, it's a well-executed vision and more than a singular one; it's a dubious Batman movie in a lot of ways, but the things that work do so well. Batman Returns is where I think everything goes off the rails, Tim Burton becomes self-indulgent and the film's 100% lack of locations makes it feel like the director either became a control freak or agoraphobic or both (there's just 11 sets total, no locations). The story is out of control nonsense, ruined by The Penguin with a clumsy, grotesque re-imagining that takes up an unholy amount of the film's runtime (Batman himself only appears in 30 minutes of the damned film). It's such an unpleasant film that its misguided efforts damn the sequels.

JediTricks wrote:With Disney wanting a larger stake in the films and pulling out until they get it (as getting just 5% of the opening day grosses isn't enough for what they're bringing to the table; this film through Disney's efforts has become Sony's highest-grossing film of all time), Sony is left with a Spider-Man that won't work the way they do things, and Disney is left with egg on their face having created an all-new theme park ride at 2 of their parks based around a property they can't use movie marketing to push anymore. Everyone loses!

To my understanding, it was Sony that pulled out of the deal, not Disney. Disney reportedly did ask for a larger cut of the box office (the amount of which I've seen several conflicting reports), but in exchange Disney would co-finance the films with Sony (which under the old deal, Sony had to do themselves). Sony apparently weren't willing to negotiate at all, and instead went to the press saying they were disappointed Disney pulled Kevin Feige’s involvement in the franchise because he's too busy with other MCU projects they own the rights for (which frankly, wasn't true given Spidey was a part of those plans).

Things have changed significantly for Sony since they originally made the deal with Disney for Marvel to use Spider-Man in the MCU. One of the biggest being Amy Pascal, who helped make the original deal on Sony's behalf, is no longer part of Sony. Now, it is Tom Rothman (known for such great choices while he worked at Fox like sewing Deadpool's mouth shut, or making Galactus a cloud) that is in charge of things for Sony, and believes they've "learned everything [they] needs to from Kevin Feige's playbook". Sony seems to think they can do Spidey again without Marvel's help, now that Disney/Marvel helped make the franchise successful again, as well as Sony's own success with "Venom" and "Into the Spider-verse".

But regardless of who is to blame (which honestly, I think both sides probably share some of), you're absolutely right that everyone loses here.

JediTricks wrote:What We Leave Behind - 8/10 - the Deep Space Nine documentary finally streamed for early backers like me. It's 2 hours long, feels like it could have been another hour easily, so much probably got left out. A bit unfocused and unclear of the point (except for focusing on Ira Steven Behr a lot, must be nice to be producer), but the smaller points and the greater whole are well-served. The HD remastering looks fantastic, if CBS doesn't put money into this, they're fools.

Did they talk about why Terry Farrell left the show? I only recently heard anything about it, and it seems like Rick Berman was being insulting to her and not taking her seriously, and she decided to walk rather than put up with any more of that. Apparently Ira Behr didn't know anything about it or he would have intervened.

Sparky Prime wrote:

JediTricks wrote:With Disney wanting a larger stake in the films and pulling out until they get it (as getting just 5% of the opening day grosses isn't enough for what they're bringing to the table; this film through Disney's efforts has become Sony's highest-grossing film of all time), Sony is left with a Spider-Man that won't work the way they do things, and Disney is left with egg on their face having created an all-new theme park ride at 2 of their parks based around a property they can't use movie marketing to push anymore. Everyone loses!

To my understanding, it was Sony that pulled out of the deal, not Disney. Disney reportedly did ask for a larger cut of the box office (the amount of which I've seen several conflicting reports), but in exchange Disney would co-finance the films with Sony (which under the old deal, Sony had to do themselves). Sony apparently weren't willing to negotiate at all, and instead went to the press saying they were disappointed Disney pulled Kevin Feige’s involvement in the franchise because he's too busy with other MCU projects they own the rights for (which frankly, wasn't true given Spidey was a part of those plans).

Things have changed significantly for Sony since they originally made the deal with Disney for Marvel to use Spider-Man in the MCU. One of the biggest being Amy Pascal, who helped make the original deal on Sony's behalf, is no longer part of Sony. Now, it is Tom Rothman (known for such great choices while he worked at Fox like sewing Deadpool's mouth shut, or making Galactus a cloud) that is in charge of things for Sony, and believes they've "learned everything [they] needs to from Kevin Feige's playbook". Sony seems to think they can do Spidey again without Marvel's help, now that Disney/Marvel helped make the franchise successful again, as well as Sony's own success with "Venom" and "Into the Spider-verse".

But regardless of who is to blame (which honestly, I think both sides probably share some of), you're absolutely right that everyone loses here.

Sony declined Disney's offer, which is their legal right. Disney came to them wanting 50% of the take for 50% of the funding as they were already producing on it (in the form of Kevin Feige's producing role and in allowing use of their MCU characters in the films), and Sony said no. Each side has suggested they are the aggrieved, so nobody outside the meetings knows for sure who pulled out, but Disney is the one who is not continuing the existing deal so in my mind they pulled out. I don't think they were entirely wrong to, but that's the risks of the business when you hold so few of the cards. Sony didn't request or require a renegotiation, that's something Disney came to them on.

I hate to speak ill of my hometown business, but Sony once they go alone will absolutely muff this just as they've muffed it every time. They have a toxic executive suite that damns every project which comes their way. Amy Pascal may not work for Sony anymore, but she is still producer on these Spidey films -- I don't have faith that she's a driving force behind any success Sony's enjoyed in the last decade, though, as she's shown signs of stepping on her own toes time and time again.

andersonh1 wrote:

JediTricks wrote:What We Leave Behind - 8/10 - the Deep Space Nine documentary finally streamed for early backers like me. It's 2 hours long, feels like it could have been another hour easily, so much probably got left out. A bit unfocused and unclear of the point (except for focusing on Ira Steven Behr a lot, must be nice to be producer), but the smaller points and the greater whole are well-served. The HD remastering looks fantastic, if CBS doesn't put money into this, they're fools.

Did they talk about why Terry Farrell left the show? I only recently heard anything about it, and it seems like Rick Berman was being insulting to her and not taking her seriously, and she decided to walk rather than put up with any more of that. Apparently Ira Behr didn't know anything about it or he would have intervened.

I haven't watched since the backers' digital stream, though I will again soon since I have the blu-ray here. I remember them touching on Terry Farrell's leaving but not really digging into it, I suspect they didn't want to shit on Rick Berman as he was also one of the interviewees on the film. They did add a little to the story other than Berman's abuse (which I've heard from so many sources that I can't help but believe) by talking about Terry not wanting a full season contract, IIRC.

JediTricks wrote:Sony declined Disney's offer, which is their legal right. Disney came to them wanting 50% of the take for 50% of the funding as they were already producing on it (in the form of Kevin Feige's producing role and in allowing use of their MCU characters in the films, and Sony said no. Each side has suggested they are the aggrieved, so nobody outside the meetings knows for sure who pulled out, but Disney is the one who is not continuing the existing deal so in my mind they pulled out. I don't think they were entirely wrong to, but that's the risks of the business when you hold so few of the cards. Sony didn't request or require a renegotiation, that's something Disney came to them on.

As I understand it, Sony never actually declined Disney's offer (supposedly it is even still possible talks between the two companies could continue. Edit Update: Wegotthiscovered is reporting that Disney and Sony will be meeting again this week to once again try and work out a deal on Spider-Man in fact), but Sony apparently has been refusing to negotiate. Disney reportedly initially offered Sony a 25/75 co-financing split (as I said, I've seen some conflicting reports on these figures, but the initial offer seems to have been around this amount at any rate) - with Sony getting the 75%. Sony reportedly didn't even respond to that offer. They didn't decline it, they didn't counter it, they didn't do anything. And apparently they gave Disney the cold shoulder for 6 months after that offer was made. At that point, Disney apparently decided to be more aggressive to get Sony's attention, increasing their co-financing offer to 50%. After that, talks broke down and Sony went to the press claiming Disney pulled out, saying that Disney told them Kevin Feige was too busy to work on Spidey. Which we only have Sony's word for that. I should also point out, it doesn't matter if Sony didn't request or require a renegotiation. The original deal was for Spidey to appear in 5 MCU films, and they reached that stipulation with Far From Home. A new deal is absolutely required for the two companies to continue to work together on Spider-Man, regardless of if Sony (or Disney for that matter) wanted a new deal, or even if the agreement ended up essentially just extending the old deal. No matter what happened, both companies had to agree to a new contract.

We'll probably never know what exactly was said in those meetings, but it's sounding to me like Sony actually wanted talks to break down so that they could bring Spidey back under their wing to bolster their own Marvel films. They've been pushing Marvel to include Venom and other spin-off films they're developing with the MCU from the start. I remember there was an interview about 2 years ago where Pascal even claimed Venom would be part of the MCU and Feige quickly said there were no plans for Venom to be included in it, making it clear it was a separate Sony project. Understandingly, Disney/Marvel doesn't want to include any of Sony's projects in the MCU that they have no say in. The new deal supposedly could have changed that by allowing Marvel some involvement on those films as well, but Sony seems to just want to mooch off the rewards of the MCU, rather than allowing Marvel any say to help them make their movies better.

I hate to speak ill of my hometown business, but Sony once they go alone will absolutely muff this just as they've muffed it every time. They have a toxic executive suite that damns every project which comes their way. Amy Pascal may not work for Sony anymore, but she is still producer on these Spidey films -- I don't have faith that she's a driving force behind any success Sony's enjoyed in the last decade, though, as she's shown signs of stepping on her own toes time and time again.

Amy Pascal might still be a producer for the Spidey films, but that's only due to contractual obligations that are still in effect. The impression I get is that she's not really a part of the decisions anymore. I'd be more concerned with Tom Rothman, who took over her job at Sony and has a track record that is even worst than Pascal's when it comes to super hero films. They are absolutely going to muff things up (again)...

Spider-Man is back!! At least for two more MCU films being one more solo Spidey film, and another MCU film. Variety reports:

On Friday, the two companies jointly announced that Marvel Studios and its president, Kevin Feige, will produce the third film in the “Spider-Man: Homecoming” series. It will once again feature Tom Holland reprising his role as the titular hero.

The new deal was signed late on Thursday night. Negotiations involved top players from both studios, including Sony Pictures chief Tom Rothman, Feige and Walt Disney Studios co-chairs Alan Horn and Alan Bergman. In exchange for lending Feige’s producing prowess, Marvel and Disney will receive roughly 25% of the profits, according to insiders. Disney will retain its merchandising rights and will put up roughly a quarter of the financing. As part of the arrangement, Spider-Man will also appear in one future Marvel Studios film.

I saw that. I think the character benefits being a part of the larger shared universe of the MCU, so I'm glad to see it. I'm not surprised they worked out a deal, there was just too much money at stake that everyone stood to benefit from.