TF Views

People are still surprised by the combined gun thing? Really?

http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Generation ... erwing.jpg

Well, I didn't read the instructions and never thought to try so...

BWprowl wrote: On top of that, because of the way his transformation works, these panels can’t rotate all the way up to become flush with the rest of the hood, so Jazz ends up with these unfortunate, square, dent shapes on top of him. It really hurts the overall aesthetic of a car mode that’s supposed look all exotic and sexy.

On mine, the square indents aren't too bad, they line up with the stripe enough that it hides their slight detent, I didn't find it a huge detraction to the design.

Transformation
Pretty straightforward Autobot Car transformation, going to Robot Mode. The way the ‘4’ on the hood splits into panels and folds down with the arms to mimic the cartoon’s chest detail is especially clever. The legs are more of an issue. They’re folded and compacted like crazy, and you’ve got to be careful of the order you move things out in. Try to bring the shins up to early, and their spring-down portions will get in the way of the feet. But be careful how you do the feet, or the heel sections will move up *past* the feet, and block the spring-shins. It’s a headache. The flimsy plastic that the feet are made out of doesn’t help, it makes it way too easy for the toe and heel sections to move out of line with each other. Folding the hood down to become the chest Automorphs the head into place, but the chest itself doesn’t lock into place at all.

I am surprised to see this as I don't have any problems transforming the feet. The instructions make it look super complex, but in reality you just hinge the feet out and then unroll the car halves until the spoiler hinges up slightly and the rear end touches it. I just tried it again, it's that simple - unfold feet, unroll lower legs. Aligning the feet is super easy since they hit the spring-loaded panel, so you just have to do the heels.

Going back to Vehicle Mode introduces new issues. Order of Operations on the feet returns with a vengeance, but now you’ve got the arms to contend with as well. Remember that cool ‘4’ panel I mentioned? Well getting it lined with to go flush through the hood is a bitch and a half, especially when you’re also trying to align the arms under the car. Overall, there are some clever concepts to this transformation, but in practice they just turn out to be no fun at all.

Same thing with the feet/lower legs, it's super simple if you just roll up the legs and then fold up the feet into that - the only addition is you have to manually adjust the spoiler, and on mine, there's 2 small panels that need to be slightly massaged due to a bit of flash.

I almost had trouble getting the hood panels to align the first time, but when I was doing it I looked from underneath and saw that it's a tab on 1 side, which means that side goes in first, and the other side aligns them both. It does need some massage, but largely it comes together for me without too much trouble. The part I find irritating is that the stupid forearms are directional in transforming back to alt mode yet look symmetrical, so it's easy to forget to rotate them around and then they drag on the ground and get in the way of the doors closing nicely.

As a side effect of its Vehicle Mode storage, the folded-up gun can also be stored under the hood in Robot Mode, if you like, which is nice.

Good point, fills in the hollowness too, but I would point out that the chest doesn't close all the way with the gun there.

the way the shins stick up from the car-shell pieces looks weird and unfinished, like they should be filled out more

I don't mind the way that looks, but I did the first time I transformed it because I didn't get the car halves all the way around so they stuck out in a funny way. Is it possible you have the same thing with the angle not being right? Besides the spoiler touching the bumper, another way to tell is the sculpted pistons on the inner face, they are vertical when done right.

The feet can move up and down well too, but you have to fiddle with those spring-shins to get the full range of motion out of them.

Ok, now I'm quite confident you're doing the lower legs only part of the way, those spring-loaded panels go completely straight down from the black pieces above them and the feet are designed to STOP at the spring panels to visually flow together, so the feet can hinge back but not forward.

and the speakers can also clip around the gun if you want it to look really stupid.

I guess this is another area where our opinions deviate (besides the white paint forearms which I think look good), the speakers can be silly on the gun but I don't think they look stupid there, and they can have a couple orientations on it.

Then just finangle them around and voila, Tracks has missile running boards! Wait, what?

It's lifted from the Viper, I think. They're kinda like pipes, on the Viper gen 1 they WERE pipes, but when Dodge moved the pipes to the rear end, they left the bulgy running boards there.

The wings also messed with me. They can actually rotate up a ‘click’ once they’re pulled out, to give the backpack room to fold in. But it’s a stiff movement, and it felt like it was gonna break. I was actually worried for a second that it was misassembled and that I’d gotten a defective Tracks. But no, it works just fine.

Too funny! I did something similar from the opposite end of the spectrum, I thought Hasbro designed the figure wrong since I had heard complaints about this bit, so I studied the slider and saw that there MIGHT be an allowance for hinging up 45 degrees, so I pushed it assuming it might be a problem I could cut into, and then it popped into place and I saw how they designed it exactly for that.

I’ll confess that I’m not a big fan of Hasbro’s current open-handed policy on Transformers. Fists generally make for ‘cooler’ poses in my opinion, and the open hands can look silly sometimes. Tracks especially does not look so great ‘holding’ his gun.

I'm somewhere in the middle of the open-hand thing, but Tracks' hands are indeed a pain in the ass. I actually don't mind how they look without holding something, but they're pretty bad holding the gun. The funny thing is, Jazz has open hands and they look fine, and because they don't have the high thumb or open index finger that Tracks does, they also look fine holding stuff.

Shockwave wrote:Prowl, it sounds like you really went out of your way to hate Jazz. Honestly between Jazz and Tracks, I really was under impressed with Tracks far more than Jazz. I wonder if maybe you just got a bad copy or you just have a lot more personal preferrences for Jazz that weren't there but some of the things you mention just seem nitpicky. Like the door wings. Jazz did have them in G1. That is he had them until that cartoon decided he didn't. And the paint on the roof. Really? NO TF figure EVER has been able to match that. Tracks certainly doesn't (his roof is actually darker blue than the rest of the car) nor do any of the others with windshields. I dunno, between the two I really think we got hosed on Tracks more than Jazz by a long shot. Jazz I can at least transform easily. Tracks is STILL a pain in the ass to transform.

I'm in the same boat as Prowl, and I certainly didn't go in TRYING to dislike Jazz. There's a good design in the figure, but plenty of bullshit design and deco choices to cut it down. And Marvel went with no doorwings for Jazz in the very first issue which came out months before the cartoon.

Tracks isn't hard to transform at all, not sure where that is coming from.

BWprowl wrote:and he's got that big obvious stripe that just *stops*.

Er, the original also had that stripe stop at the roof: http://www.tfu.info/1984/Autobot/Jazz/jazz.htm
That said, the original also had a real rear window and paint behind it it on the spoiler while the new one suffers from a very plain rear end.

In terms of transformation, I'm the opposite. I've got Tracks's folding-the-arms-in-the-back thing down pat, while I still have to wrestle with Jazz's '4' panels for ages every time. It actively discourages me from transforming him back to vehicle mode. And the black-painted-white arms are just unforgivable.

I guess I'm in the middle, I don't find either of them particularly difficult to transform, but I do find Jazz's hood and arms to be inelegant to get back to alt mode where Tracks is all charm.

Shockwave wrote:Also, I've always preferred the door wings. The comic originally had them too. Until they started copying the cartoon model. Cause you know, after the cartoon came out, absolutely everything else had to copy it exactly *cough**cough* FIBRIR *cough**cough* I guess a fold down option would have been nice for those that would prefer he didn't have wings.

Bzzt! Super wrong dude, here's Jazz from the first issue of The Transformers which came out in May of 1984: http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Jazzg1marvelfirst.jpg

-Is now going to try to get those wings to fold down. Somehow.

You'll need to remove the pin holding in the roof hinge, and then the doors are going to not fold in close enough to put the roof back on - each door is the same length as the back, so they will hit the opposite door, and that's not taking into account the speakers. The best you can get out of it I think is to leave everything pinned together and fold the doorwings back so they're about a centimeter from touching at the tips, it's about 20 degrees past pointing backwards, and looks pretty bad unfortunately.

I've found that if you move the windshield down you can get the doors angled slightly behind him

You don't even need move the roof down, leaving it up gets you nearly the same thing, and if you drop the speakers down they still touch at the joint so there's no benefit to dropping the roof. But the end result still looks like a pointy backpack from any angle except straight on.

Onslaught Six wrote:I got Thunderwing! His transformation is nothing special, but who the hell is buying this guy for his altmode?

Me! That headsculpt is a let-down.

I also can't get his guns to hold together for more than three seconds. It's because it's all friction on those two tiny tabs; he needs a peg for it to work fully. Part of me wishes he had another weapon, too, but hey.

On mine, the twin guns merge fine. Try reversing it, maybe one of the guns has bad tabs or slots.

Shockwave wrote:Well, I didn't read the instructions and never thought to try so...

It's why the triggers are notched, the missile's fin passes through the other gun's trigger when they're docked together.

Well color me wrong. Maybe I was thinking of the ads on the back of the UK issues. They always used the box art which had the wings. Either way, I've always liked winged Jazz better. And actually now that I think about , the UK story "Man of Iron" used the toy models instead of the cartoon models.

I just find the back end of Tracks to be a pain in my "back end". When I moved Jazz's roof down I was able to angle the doors more than when I had it up. At least that's how it was on mine. But yeah, still an angled backpack. And I got Thunderwing's guns merged. Mark me down for one who's guns work fine.

JediTricks wrote:

BWProwl wrote:and the speakers can also clip around the gun if you want it to look really stupid.

I guess this is another area where our opinions deviate (besides the white paint forearms which I think look good), the speakers can be silly on the gun but I don't think they look stupid there, and they can have a couple orientations on it.

I don't see a problem with the speaker-gun, at least conceptually. Jazz's bio talked about a disorienting sound and light show, the speaker-gun could be a handheld transmitter or said effect. Or failing that, well, Sonic Death Scream weapons aren't without precedent in TFs.

JediTricks wrote:

BWprowl wrote:and he's got that big obvious stripe that just *stops*.

Er, the original also had that stripe stop at the roof: http://www.tfu.info/1984/Autobot/Jazz/jazz.htm
That said, the original also had a real rear window and paint behind it it on the spoiler while the new one suffers from a very plain rear end.

What? What're the both of you talking about, here? Obviously Jazz's stripe would end at his back window--what, it's gonna keep going past it? But the way Prowl and you talk about it, it's like he doesn't have a roof stripe at all.

Now, as for the stripe stopping underneath the 4 (which is, I assume, what Prowl was trying to complain about) I'd like to point to the the actual racing car that Diaclone Porche 935 was based on, which became Jazz nearly verbatim. The stripe stops before the 4 and continues after it. There were several other cars with different numbers (1, 5, 40 are just some of the others I've seen) and they all have the stripe stopping there. You can complain about it if you want but it's accurate to how the actual car was.

That said, if it bothers you that much, there's the inevitable Reprolabels set.

-Is now going to try to get those wings to fold down. Somehow.

You'll need to remove the pin holding in the roof hinge, and then the doors are going to not fold in close enough to put the roof back on - each door is the same length as the back, so they will hit the opposite door, and that's not taking into account the speakers. The best you can get out of it I think is to leave everything pinned together and fold the doorwings back so they're about a centimeter from touching at the tips, it's about 20 degrees past pointing backwards, and looks pretty bad unfortunately.

Hasbro should have cheaped out and just put them on plastic hinges so that they could clip off.

Onslaught Six wrote:I got Thunderwing! His transformation is nothing special, but who the hell is buying this guy for his altmode?

Me! That headsculpt is a let-down.

It really is, but hey, it's Thunderwing. Plus, somebody will do one of those unofficial upgrade kits I don't buy anyway--eventually. (They did one for Bludgeon! Nothing's wrong with Bludgeon!)

On mine, the twin guns merge fine. Try reversing it, maybe one of the guns has bad tabs or slots.

I've thought about that, and I don't know if it's both or what.

I'm planning to alter the head a bit. I'll play around with mine first though and see how it come out. If I can get one a little more Geewunny looking then I'll offer it to you guys.

Onslaught Six wrote:

Onslaught Six wrote:I got Thunderwing! His transformation is nothing special, but who the hell is buying this guy for his altmode?

Me! That headsculpt is a let-down.

It really is, but hey, it's Thunderwing. Plus, somebody will do one of those unofficial upgrade kits I don't buy anyway--eventually. (They did one for Bludgeon! Nothing's wrong with Bludgeon!)

Hasbro went with a sculpt for Thunderwing's face based off the IDW comic rather than the original figure. Take a look at how the face was drawn for Stormbringer, and compare that with the jagged toothy grin from the Marvel comics, which was much closer to the original toy. I think I'd have preferred the original look, but Hasbro has been working to represent their G1 figures in IDW comics and to base some figures and sculpts off IDW designs (Drift, Blurr's headsculpt) for the last few years, so it's not a surprise.

andersonh1 wrote:
Hasbro went with a sculpt for Thunderwing's face based off the IDW comic rather than the original figure. Take a look at how the face was drawn for Stormbringer, and compare that with the jagged toothy grin from the Marvel comics, which was much closer to the original toy. I think I'd have preferred the original look, but Hasbro has been working to represent their G1 figures in IDW comics and to base some figures and sculpts off IDW designs (Drift, Blurr's headsculpt) for the last few years, so it's not a surprise.

Put that way, I'm more okay with Thunderwing's head a little more. I kind of feel like, if there's gonna be a G1 comic and retro-G1 toyline, then there oughtta be more connection between 'em. Dammit, if I buy a Transformers comic, it'd be nice to see the toys I've got in action. Or alternately, if I see a guy that's friggin' awesome in the comic, I want a toy of that dude. Or close to it, anyway. I know, probably odd thing to say, but I kind of think that was one of the old book's biggest strengths, and the new one can certainly learn from it. Which, I guess, the point is that they are learning from it. So carry on, Hasbro and IDW.

Of course, I'd still sort of preferred the G1 face, too, but mainly because I didn't like Stormbringer that much from the beginning. But anyway.

I've got Blurr now, I thought I'd review him. And true to the character, it'll be a fast review.
Backstory: Loved Blurr in the movie and in Animated. Didn't think I'd want this toy because the Drift mold didn't look like Blurr. Bought it because it's hard to find and thought one of y'all might want it. However, I don't think that plan's gonna work out.

Car mode: The paintjob here is out of sight. I don't know why I'm this impressed with it, but I am. Four shades of blue stacked on top of each other. It just caught my eye, and even though this car mode is pretty much the same as the Drift version, this new paint really makes it stand out. Good lord it's good. Moving on.

Robot Mode: Like I said, I'm still not convinced that this looks like Blurr. The mold just doesn't scream "Really fast dude" to me. But good lord. The same four blues from the car mode come into play here, and they're all so well arranged, the toy just blows me away how damn pretty it is. I know, I know, I sound like a fangirl or something, but this thing's just one of the most aesthetically pleasing transformers I've bought this year. Also, I'm pretty convinced that the robot mode actually looks better in person than it does on the picture on the back of the card. Beyond the great new colorscheme, the head's the biggest change here. It sort of looks like Blurr, but then he's got the wings on the side of his helmet, which suggests Hermes, a god who certainly was pretty damn fast, but ironically, makes the head look..well, less like Blurr. Still, looks damn good, can't fault that.

Guns!: Then there's the other big change. Blurr's pistols are no big deal, really. They look like a pair of pistols, nothing flashy or too detailed, really. Serviceable, though. The sniper rifle's a little more of a detailed weapon, and is indeed friggin' huge. Also, not nearly as bendy as Drift's sword, so nice bonus there. All the guns have their combining feature, so the pistols' handles can support the rifle, which is a neat feature. Everything stashes as well on the figure as Drift's swords did, but Blurr's pistols take some more work to get out of their holsters. Wouldn't you think that Blurr would do okay with bladed weapons, as fast as he can go?

Overall: If you find this dude, you could do a lot worse than to buy the hell out of him. A repaint that just knocks it out of the park with a new color scheme. Blurr might not have been my first choice for this mold to be repainted into, but oh, man, I'm glad they did it. I recommend this thing, buuuuut I'm afraid I won't be selling mine off. Thing looks way too cool to get rid of.

Onslaught Six wrote:

JediTricks wrote:

BWprowl wrote:and he's got that big obvious stripe that just *stops*.

Er, the original also had that stripe stop at the roof: http://www.tfu.info/1984/Autobot/Jazz/jazz.htm
That said, the original also had a real rear window and paint behind it it on the spoiler while the new one suffers from a very plain rear end.

What? What're the both of you talking about, here? Obviously Jazz's stripe would end at his back window--what, it's gonna keep going past it? But the way Prowl and you talk about it, it's like he doesn't have a roof stripe at all.

I was pointing out that the original had the racing stripe stop at the roof, but that figure also had a real rear window and painted details on the aft section so it didn't look like a boring white unfinished mess the way the new figure does.

Hasbro should have cheaped out and just put them on plastic hinges so that they could clip off.

That could have worked. I don't know why they pinned the roof and the doors, it's an extra expense. Maybe they had trouble with drop-safety, or maybe they just wanted to avoid any possible drop-safety troubles. Odd because they have done roofs with friction hinges before, and doorwings too (Battle Blade Bumblebee is a recent example).

Shockwave wrote:I'm planning to alter the head a bit. I'll play around with mine first though and see how it come out. If I can get one a little more Geewunny looking then I'll offer it to you guys.

andersonh1 wrote:Hasbro went with a sculpt for Thunderwing's face based off the IDW comic rather than the original figure. Take a look at how the face was drawn for Stormbringer, and compare that with the jagged toothy grin from the Marvel comics, which was much closer to the original toy. I think I'd have preferred the original look, but Hasbro has been working to represent their G1 figures in IDW comics and to base some figures and sculpts off IDW designs (Drift, Blurr's headsculpt) for the last few years, so it's not a surprise.

For me, it's the head sculpt being a bit plain and quite soft, softer even than the 22-year-old original IMO, so better paint can only carry it so far, but I look forward to seeing any paint attempts.