TF Views

Dominic wrote:What is Morrison doing? The arc has barely begun, largely for Morrison being sloppy about deadlines.

I guess he's supposedly doing this thing where, not joking at all, Batman is going to use Bruce Wayne's power to set up Batman splinter groups across the world. He's calling it Batman, Inc.

It's like Morrison just saw the Iron Man movies for the first time, and Marvel's not going to let him write Iron Man, are you crazy? So he's doing it with Batman instead.

I don't know, I think Batman Inc. makes sense. You already got Dick, Tim, Jason, Stephanie, Cass, and Damien. That's enough Batmen and Robins to start a Justice League of their own. Then you figure in the "Club of Heroes" Batman belongs to with Knight and Squire and those other guys, and Batman having a worldwide network isn't odd, it's about inevitable. More on this later.

EDIT: And...whatshername. Batwoman! You got Batwoman, too!

The basic premise is sound. There are two problems. One, it will not stick. Two, Morrison will find some way to make it completely wank-tastic self-indulgence. (That is seriously self-indulging wankery for those of you not paying attention.)

And didn't they already kind of do that with OMEC? or OMAC? Or whatever the hell it was called. I like the idea of McBatmen.

Dominic wrote:The implication is that Mephisto warped physics enough for it to work, as per the deal. That makes sense, even if OMD was a terrible idea.

I know what the implication is, but that doesn't excuse how the story comes off with Peter saving Aunt May with just CPR (even if devil magic allowed it to work) when science and magic couldn't do anything before. If anything, it seems to suggest it was Mephisto that was preventing them from saving her in the first place, which would only make the story more contrived than it already is.

Anyway, I kinda like the idea of Batman Inc. myself. Maybe not so much the idea of several people in Batman costumes, but the idea of Batman-esk characters protecting cities beyond just Gotham at any rate. It makes sense. Bruce has made a difference in Gotham with his operations, why not expand that to other cities that could use some help?

Mephisto might be more powerful, or simply more willing to use said powers than the other parties were. That much makes sense.

And, it would make sense for Mephisto to hinder other efforts to help May if he really wanted Spiderman's marriage to end. Of course, I never understood why he was so hot for that to happen.

So, yeah, OMD sucks. Even my rational defenses of some points of it fall into the trap of it sucking.


Dom
-gave up on "Spiderman" in the 90s.....

Dominic wrote:Mephisto might be more powerful, or simply more willing to use said powers than the other parties were. That much makes sense.

And, it would make sense for Mephisto to hinder other efforts to help May if he really wanted Spiderman's marriage to end. Of course, I never understood why he was so hot for that to happen.

Except the problem with that is Dr. Strange was willing and able to erase all knowledge of Peter revealing his secret identity. So why wouldn't he be willing or able to he restore the health of a little old lady after a simple gunshot wound? It doesn't make sense that as Sorcerer Supreme, Dr. Strange couldn't do anything to help her. And, someone like Dr. Strange should be able to detect such magic tampering if Mephisto was hindering others efforts...

So, yeah, OMD sucks. Even my rational defenses of some points of it fall into the trap of it sucking.

Ultimately, that's what it comes to. I'm not sure there is such as thing as "rational" for this story though. It was so terrible and contrived, not to mention totally undermined the character only for the sake of Quesada getting what he personally wanted.

I can see a being as primal and powerful as Mephisto being able to influence events as he is implied/assumed to ahve done. That makes perfect sense. It makes as much sense as me stripping nekkid and running home from work on this cold October morning.

I could totally do it. But...would I? (No. I will not.) But, you can rationally comprehend me being able to, right?

Similarly, I can see Mephisto being able to hide his influence from Strange.

Except the problem with that is Dr. Strange was willing and able to erase all knowledge of Peter revealing his secret identity. So why wouldn't he be willing or able to he restore the health of a little old lady after a simple gunshot wound? It doesn't make sense that as Sorcerer Supreme, Dr. Strange couldn't do anything to help her. And, someone like Dr. Strange should be able to detect such magic tampering if Mephisto was hindering others efforts...

Well, one is mucking around with life and death. The other....that is just mucking around with people's memories of their lives and formative experiences. See, one is so much worse...or.....ah screw it.

Dominic wrote:I can see a being as primal and powerful as Mephisto being able to influence events as he is implied/assumed to ahve done. That makes perfect sense.

Sure, for those unaware of magical influences, but that wouldn't make any sense for someone like Dr. Strange. Again, as Sorcerer Supreme, Strange should be able to detect Mephisto's magic... Actually, Strange might be more powerful than Mephisto as by Marvel's definition the Sorcerer Supreme has "greater skills than all others or commands a greater portion of the ambient magical energies than any other organism on a given world or dimension".

Similarly, I can see Mephisto being able to hide his influence from Strange.

I can't. Again, as Sorcerer Supreme, Strange should be able to detect that magic.

Well, one is mucking around with life and death. The other....that is just mucking around with people's memories of their lives and formative experiences. See, one is so much worse...or.....ah screw it.

He wouldn't have really been mucking around with life and death... Aunt May was still alive at the time. So couldn't he just... you know, magically restore her or something? I'd think that'd be much simpler than erasing all evidence of Peter revealing his secret identity across the entire planet.

And something interesting I've found, while looking through back issues.... At the end of "House of M", Peter asks Dr. Strange to erase his memories of HoM, but Strange tells him "That's not how the magics work". Oops.

Just to play devil's advocate for a second...

Is Mephisto magic? I don't know if Marvel's gone as far as to say that Mephisto's officially the fallen angel and all that like DC has with Lucifer, but if we assume that he's pretty much the biblical devil, then would his power be technically magic, or just straight-up changing the world around him through sheer willpower? Which, I know, talk about splitting hairs and all, but I figure a being like that's gonna be more powerful than any mortal sorcerer, even the best of all of 'em.

Which is not to say that "OMD" is anything but a horrible idea badly executed, just throwing that out there.

As for the bit where Spidey begged for amnesia and Strange was like, "Can't do it, man"..yeah, huge flub on Joey Q's part there. I mean, again, one could nit-pick and say that Mephisto made it so that would work, but that'd be grasping at straws there. It's just two writer's interpretations of magic that don't jibe, and usually one could be like "Eh, it's magic, you can't define it, so don't worry about it". But when it comes to a major plot point like that, and the two contradicting statements are so close together chronologically, then yeah, somebody pulled a boner.