TF Views

Dom wrote:In the case of "Knightfall", how much *better* could the story have been (at a purely event-driven level) if Bruce Wayne's injuries did not heal enough for him to become Batman. The escapees from Arkham Asylum would be rounded up, but Bruce would stay broken and a replacement would be needed. The writers could still throw in character moments showing Bruce adjusting to a role as a mentor/strategist and his replacement adjusting to being the new Batman. New characters=new stories=new drama.

Dude, have you never seen Batman Beyond? That was pretty much the entire point of the series, including Bruce's role as you described there.

With that in mind, recall that fans *loved* Batman Beyond, and it exists as a progression of the ongoing canon the was the DC Animated Universe.

Anyway, I think you just need to read more Manga for the sort of thing you want here. JoJo's Bizarre Adventure would be great for you.

Manga is something that I can take in limited quantities due to the over-all style and tone.


I liked what I saw of "Batman Beyond". But, it was not quite the same as a story where things change over time, ya know?


Part of me wonders if post-"Flashpoint" DC and post-"Age of Ultron" Marvel are going to follow a more linear structure. Conventional wisdom says that the push for reboots is coming from Warner Brothers and Disney for the purposes of making the comics more appealling for new readers lured in by movies and other non-comic merchandise/content.

Mainstream audiences of the sort brought in by movies do not have much tolerance for repetition and restoration. Characters that die in movies tend to stay dead, and audiences are okay with it. If anything, they might be put off by constant returns by dead/crippled/changed characters. Similarly, outside of sitcoms and kid-shows, doing the same thing over and over and over again is not tolerated. This might force comic companies to accept linear stories and to avoid constantly rehashing old plots. (The Phoenix would show up once, and be gone. Jason Todd would stay dead.)



Dom
-maybe Professor X will stay dead.

Dominic wrote:Part of me wonders if post-"Flashpoint" DC and post-"Age of Ultron" Marvel are going to follow a more linear structure.

I like how you're still 100% convinced this Marvel reboot is going to happen. Age of Ultron ends in, what, three weeks, and we've heard no official word, or even seen any leaks pertaining to the subject? How far along are Marvel's solicits, does everything for the next few months look like things continue along unchanged? Even DC's New 52 was planned out enough that we knew it was happening a couple months in advance.

I mean jeez, Free Comic Book Day is this Saturday. If Marvel was *really* about to reboot their whole damn universe in less than a month, this would be the PERFECT place to put out a special issue all about that! And yet, nothing.

I think you just want this to happen *too much*, Dom.

The last "Event" that I bought hoping that the changes would stick was World War Hulk. I was really hoping that would be it for the character. I wound up trading those back to the comic shop, but I have to assume that Hulk came back at some point? Anyone wanna or is able to fill me in on that?

Yup. Hulk is back on Earth, not much the worse for things.

Not sure of the how and why. But, yeah, he is back.

I think you just want this to happen *too much*, Dom.

I do want it to happen. But, I do not think that I am too far off.

I can double check with the comic shop guy to see what his sources were.

But, apparently, Marvel's current Thanos series (the one written by Jason Aaron) is his definitive origin. Iron Man's origin is getting another re-working. And, there are all of those "Season 1" series from the last few years. Apparently, "Avengers Assemble" (featuring the 616 analogues of the movie characters) is supposed to be Thanos' first big move for the Infinity gems. On CBR, somebody pointed out that movie Ultron was created by Stark, not Pym. This could end up with that being a big change.

"Flash Point" hit very abruptly. Some people did not know about it until it hit. And, even people who saw it coming were suprised at the scale of the changes. "Flashpoint" also hit in September, which is.....nothing for the industry. The Summer convention season is more or less over. Summer movie hype would have tapered off. (Fall conventions are usually October or November.)

And, like "Flashpoint", "Age of Ultron" is following an event that arguably would have been a better place for this kind of reset. (Though "Flashpoint" was fully 3 years after "Final Crisis" while "Avengers v/s X-Men" was only a year ago.) I am giving "Age of Ultron" points for having some non-convention elements (such as the important fight happening *away* from Ultron). But, I am more interested in what happens *after* "Age of Ultron" ends. Marvel has never been shy about retcons and back-writes. But, those have generally been superficially consistent with what was published before. If this is a reboot, it would be the first time that Marvel had direct changes to their on-page history.


Dom
-and, if they avoid the Jim Lee control art, they might get away with it.

Shockwave wrote:The last "Event" that I bought hoping that the changes would stick was World War Hulk. I was really hoping that would be it for the character. I wound up trading those back to the comic shop, but I have to assume that Hulk came back at some point? Anyone wanna or is able to fill me in on that?

Basically, Hulk becomes the new ruler of the planet he ended up on until the stardrive of the ship that brought him there explodes, causing many to die. Hulk thinks the Illuminati that sent him to this planet are responsible for it, so Hulk and his Warbound friends take another ship to Earth to get revenge on them.

Dominic wrote:On CBR, somebody pointed out that movie Ultron was created by Stark, not Pym. This could end up with that being a big change.

Um... There is no movie version of Ultron. At least not yet.

There was a direct to video cartoon (Next Avengers: Heroes of Tomorrow) where Stark created Ultron based on Pym's brain waves that person might have been thinking of, but that's a standalone alternate future type storyline where Ultron had taken over the planet and the kids of the Avengers had to take it back.

But, I am more interested in what happens *after* "Age of Ultron" ends.

Avengers A.I.

I get the feeling that the changes Marvel makes will be similar in scope to what DC did "Zero Hour" or the Crisis Trilogy more than "Crisis on Infinite Earths" or "Flashpoint". Some events will be re-written or tossed. But, character models and more basic elements will stay intact.


Dom
-expects War Machine to get a significant overhaul as one of the few 90s characters likely to come through this.

Sparky Prime wrote:

Shockwave wrote:The last "Event" that I bought hoping that the changes would stick was World War Hulk. I was really hoping that would be it for the character. I wound up trading those back to the comic shop, but I have to assume that Hulk came back at some point? Anyone wanna or is able to fill me in on that?

Basically, Hulk becomes the new ruler of the planet he ended up on until the stardrive of the ship that brought him there explodes, causing many to die. Hulk thinks the Illuminati that sent him to this planet are responsible for it, so Hulk and his Warbound friends take another ship to Earth to get revenge on them.

Right, that was World War Hulk. He came back and everyone on Earth was fighting against him and he basically wound up in a coma under a lake or some shit. I'm wordering what happened after that.

Shockwave wrote:Right, that was World War Hulk. He came back and everyone on Earth was fighting against him and he basically wound up in a coma under a lake or some shit. I'm wordering what happened after that.

He came back at some point. Then Red Hulk popped up, then lots of other different-colored Hulk Corps appeared, and it all coalesced into Smashest Night.

Wait, no, that can't be right...

But Red Hulk was actually a different character, General Ross if I'm not mistaken, right? And sadly I can totally believe that that's right.