Comics are Awesome II

[Sparky Prime]

Superman and Hawkman circa 1986 say otherwise. DC was an editorial clusterfuck for a year or two after "Crisis on Infinite Earths".

Like I said, it is all speculation. But, there is precedent for this sort of thinking.

I don't see that it's the same situation here for that precedent to apply in the first place. They've already established Damian as part of the New52 timeline and has been so for over a year. Killing him off now is not going to change that.

In theory, DC could come out and edit Damien out by decree with minimal damage to other books.

To other books that haven't interacted with Damian or have little to do with the Bat-books perhaps, but it would have an impact on several titles. DC is releasing covers showing the various Bat-related characters reacting to Damian's death that goes beyond the Bat books (such as Teen Titans and World's Finest) already as it is.

[Dominic]

Hawkman and Superman both showed up post-Crisis and did not get their final revisions until about a year later. This meant that significant runs of non-Superman and Hawkman books were stricket as late as 1987.


And, speaking of reboots stricking comics from context....


Captain Atom volume 1:
"Crisis" and "Flashpoint" style stories inherently call for some characters being significantly re-written and sanitized of past context. One character that was sorely in need of being sanitized was Captain Atom.

DC acquired Captain Atom, along with other characters from the defunct Charlton Comics company in the 1980s. In 1986, Captain Atom and the rest of the Charlton characters, (along with characters bought from Fawcett and Quality comics), were folded in to mainline DC during "Crisis on Infinite Earts". Captain Atom was one of several characters that DC aggressively pushed in the late 1980s. But, for various reasons, Captain Atom was also one of several characters that DC was never quite able to rebrand as an A-lister.

In 1991, DC published "Armageddon 2001", the story of a bleak future (in the far off year of 2001, in which a super hero went bad and....yadda yadda...fascist distopia....blah blah blah.....seriously, you know the story because you have seen it before......everybody was dead.......

At the time, DC was still trying to cash in on the credibility that "Crisis on Inifinte Earths" earned them. In theory, the mystery bad guy could have been anybody, and the only way to figure out who it was would be to buy all of that summer's annuals. In real terms, comics fans were able to narrow it down to a half dozen (or less) likely choices, including Captain Atom. Mid-summer, DC changed course, and revealed that Monarch (the mystery super-baddie) was in fact uh....Hawk...from the then recently cancelled "Hawk and Dove" book. Hawk (as Monarch) and Captain Atom got sucked in to the time stream...a bunch of stuff happened...."Zero Hour".....some other stuff.....

Eventually, in one of the stupidest "we fixed it" moves since Busiek's undoing of Byrne's ill-planned Vision/Human Torch reveal (which I will be getting to later this year in the retro thread), it was revealed that Hawk was never Monarch and had been brain washed and....uh....some stuff....Captain Atom met the Wildstorm characters (which DC bought at some point in the last decade....and uh....I dunno.......

After "Infinite Crisis", Captain Atom was trapped in the ruins of Bludhaven and picked up still more baggage, including a shiny set of Monarch armour. (This might have had more impact had "Battle for Bludhaven" not been published in 2006, 5 years after somebody was supposed to become Monarch....) From there, Captain Atom....raised an army.....marauded across many dimensions....murdered 50+ of his own multiversal counterparts.....and.......eventually getting blown up in an alternate universe...along with that universe.....

At some point after the "Crisis Trilogy" resolved, Captain Atom was uh....a good guy again. And, everything was just okay. We knew everythign was okay because...uh, Captain Atom said that he was a good guy again, so it was okay...uh right?

Thankfully, that is all gone post "Flashpoint".

The new "Captain Atom" series is set more or less current with the rest of DC's "new 52" books. His origin is fundamentally the same. DC is playing Captain Atom as "Doctor Manhattan but with social graces". Krul's Captain Atom is meant to illustrate the full range of potential, and limitations, of superhumans. Captain Atom and those around him all illustrate different angles on that question. Some people treat Atom as a curiosity, others fear him while still others seek to control him. For his part, Atom has to adjust to his new-found (and barely understood/controlled) powers.

It would be easier to sort out how well Krul handled this if the "Captain Atom" compilation reprinted the entire series, rather than only 6 issues. (Hopefully, DC will either produce a the second volume, or I will be able to track down the individual issues.)

Grade: B (pending)


Dom
-still not sure how Captain Atom ended up a good guy after "Countdown".

[Sparky Prime]

Hawkman and Superman both showed up post-Crisis and did not get their final revisions until about a year later. This meant that significant runs of non-Superman and Hawkman books were stricket as late as 1987.

It doesn't matter how they handled things in 1987, this is a completely different event with its own set of rules. Just because they did that then does not mean there is a precedent for it now.

[Dominic]

Uh, precedent is typically found in the past, "then".

Anyway, I ended up with a big pile of new crap this week, so I am going to blow through these.


World's Finest #10:
I grabbed this because it tied in with the death of Damien Wayne. I dropped this book because there was not much happening and it was not about much. There may have been some light set-up for a cross-over with "Earth 2". But, other than that, not much has changed. And, if this week's CSN is anything to go by, Power Girl will be de-redesigned to have her pre-"Flashpoint" costume. (The new costume is terrible. But, this is a huge step backwards, if only visually.)
Grade: C

Earth 2 #10:
This is probably the weakest issue of the run. There were a few pages that were clearly "info-dump explication" of the sort that started to go out of style in the 80s. Robinson is setting up for Green Lantern to be joining the rest of the team and that set-up likely ties in with Steppenwolf. But, Robinson's "character as explicative narrator" dialogue, while only prominent on a few pages, is *really* offensive.
Grade: C

Legends of the Dark Knight #6:
This issue goes back to the "multiple short stories" format. The first is a "day in the life" story. Batman may be "waging a one man war on crime", but he has great field support in the form of Gotham City's regular folk. The second story features Killer Croc and (what looked to be) Hugo Strange. It may have been better as a full issue story, and Strange(?) just sort of shows up at the end. The third and final story is similar, though with better art. All in all, it is not the best issue. But, the selling point of this series is that the content is random, so there is reason to look forward to next issue.
Grade: B/C

Iron Man #007:
The "God Killer" arc continues. Stark gets advice from a Living Recorder for how to handle being on trial for killing the Phoenix(!?!) during AvX. Stark manages to hold his own during a trial by combat sequence, (with each individual charge being sorted out by a different fight). But, the plan falls apart when his accusers hire Death's Head to be the prosecutorial champion. This expands on what I thought was a silly cameo in the last issue. Death's Head is ~30 feet tall, which strongly implies that this is set between his appearances in the TF UK comics (20+ years ago) and his subsequent appearances in Doctor Who and older Marvel 616 comics. (Ironically, the "future" shown in those old UK TF comics is now the past to us.)
Grade: B

Age of Ultron #1:
Some stuff happens. The first issue is set in the ruins New York City. Apparently, the "big changes" have all happened before the first issue. If the previews are anything to go by, fixing the problem is likely to involved time travel or something. Marvel is promising "big changes", but that is nothing new. There have been rumours that Marvel is planning a "Flashpoint" style reset. And, in theory, "Age of Ultron" could be that sort of event. But, in practical terms, I am doubtful. Marvel promises "big changes" every year or two. But, aside from a slightly better track record of keeping dead characters dead than DC has, Marvel is generally averse to change. And, the cover is all shiny and foil covered. It is very 90s! This is something to flip through, and maybe read as filler. But, it is nothing worth getting too excited over, especially given how many tie-ins it will have.
Grade: C


Dom
-would like to see Marvel pull a "Flashpoint", but is not anticipating it.

[Sparky Prime]

I meant that there is no precedent just because they did that "then" for there to be any reason to believe they'd do the same thing now. Thought that would have been obvious even with how I phrased it, but moving on...

Red Lanterns #17
The ghost of Krona tells Atrocitus about his past having lost a wife and child of his own before he became obsessed with the past and life and death. Atrocitus moves on but admits he feels pity for Krona although he believes he only feels this because their goal is nearby, the Great Heart. It turns out this is the object the Guardians used to siphon off and store their emotions in. Smashing through the floor he and the Manhunters comes across a subterranean city where some androids inform them none that haven't been cleansed of emotion can approach the Great Heart because it will draw out the emotions of any around it. Atroctius deals with them while the Manhunters grab the Great Heart, but then the First Lantern shows up...

Not sure what to make of this Great Heart concept. The way I've always understood the Guardians is that they do feel emotion, they just suppress it, somewhat like Vulcans from Star Trek. Seeing as we have seen emotional outbursts from the Guardians over the years, and both Ganthet and Sayd had re-embraced their emotions. But I do kinda like the idea that the Guardians did more than simply suppress their emotions. And what exactly is Atrocitus plan for it? To force the Guardians to take their emotions back? Having Krona's ghost show up seemed a bit wasted here as well. It seems they only did it so Atroctius would feel pity for his greatest enemy for him to overcome that emotion with his Rage at the end of this issue. I guess I was just expected something a bit more significant to come out of it.

Green Lantern #18
With Simon now in the Dead Zone, Sinestro tries to make a grab for the power ring but Simon shoots him with his gun to stop him after the ring fails to. Tomar-Re explains they cannot die here because they are already dead, but at the same time the three of them still have one foot on the living side. He further explains news travels fast in Dead Zone, as they know Volthoom is now free. Volthoom it turns out traveled from an unknown time and place to witness Krona's discovery of the birth of the universe because that was the moment the Guardians also discovered the emotional spectrum. Volthoom was the first to use its power by bathing himself in the Light of Creation itself, and became part of that Light. Meaning they cannot destroy Volthoom or they will also destroy all of creation with him, but they still have to stop him or he will cause the suffering of every being in existence and warp reality to his own choosing. B'dg manages to lock onto Simon's ring through Black Hand's ring, and Simon creates a duplicate to take Hal with him. However, Sinestro fights Hal for it, and is able to grab the ring instead. Black Hand is then sent to the Dead Zone with Simon and Sinestro freed. Tomar-Re doubts Sinestro will succeed without help. He tells Hal the only other way out of the Dead Zone was when Nekron invaded using the Black Lantern rings, but Hal cannot use the power of the Black Lantern ring, unless he is completely dead...

Not a whole lot of plot progression here but it does fill in a few blanks. Not sure why Simon got to keep wearing the ring if he's also suppose to sorta be dead just like Hal and Sinestro are. But Hal does tell him not to take it off at least because they don't know what the ring would do at that point. Guess the ring could just be confused given the conflicting life readings. Lot's of background on Volthoom here. Tomar-Re also mentioned the Guardians created the Manhunters to help them stop him the first time. Which makes sense considering his powers, he wouldn't be able to effect them as androids without emotion. I guess after that threat was over the Guardians decided to re-purpose them to police the universe. Though it begs to question, why did they take it upon themselves to police the universe at that point? Perhaps something Volthoom did to the universe that they felt responsible for? And it looks like the prophecy that Hal will become the greatest Black Lantern will come true in the next issue.

[andersonh1]

Saw the Green Lantern issue yesterday, but waffled on buying the book. I may have to get back into buying GL monthly if Hal is back in the storyline. Honestly at this point, as much as I've enjoyed a lot of what Geoff Johns has done for Green Lantern, I'm ready for the change in writer. I'm looking forward to some fresh ideas.

DC's facebook page is celebrating 1 million page likes. Ironically, very few of their books sell even 1/10th of that.

[BWprowl]

Iron Man #007:
The "God Killer" arc continues. Stark gets advice from a Living Recorder for how to handle being on trial for killing the Phoenix(!?!) during AvX. Stark manages to hold his own during a trial by combat sequence, (with each individual charge being sorted out by a different fight). But, the plan falls apart when his accusers hire Death's Head to be the prosecutorial champion. This expands on what I thought was a silly cameo in the last issue. Death's Head is ~30 feet tall, which strongly implies that this is set between his appearances in the TF UK comics (20+ years ago) and his subsequent appearances in Doctor Who and older Marvel 616 comics. (Ironically, the "future" shown in those old UK TF comics is now the past to us.)
Grade: B

Interesting, Death's Head popped up in last week's Avenging Spider-Man as well. I wonder if Marvel is actively pushing him all of a sudden, for some reason. Maybe he'll end up having a role in Age of Ultron or something?

Age of Ultron #1:
Some stuff happens. The first issue is set in the ruins New York City. Apparently, the "big changes" have all happened before the first issue. If the previews are anything to go by, fixing the problem is likely to involved time travel or something. Marvel is promising "big changes", but that is nothing new. There have been rumours that Marvel is planning a "Flashpoint" style reset. And, in theory, "Age of Ultron" could be that sort of event. But, in practical terms, I am doubtful. Marvel promises "big changes" every year or two. But, aside from a slightly better track record of keeping dead characters dead than DC has, Marvel is generally averse to change. And, the cover is all shiny and foil covered. It is very 90s! This is something to flip through, and maybe read as filler. But, it is nothing worth getting too excited over, especially given how many tie-ins it will have.
Grade: C

I'm surprised at your lukewarm reception of this, given your boy Bendis is writing it. Is he just not in top form on this one? Maybe he's held back by the event format?

Anyway:

The Superior Spider-Man #5-
Oh man, remember how I said the novelty seemed to be wearing off of Superior Spider-Man? I was wrong, the series is back in top form this issue, in fact, it might be even better. Here are things that happen in issue #5: Massacre goes into advertising, Otto meets up with an adorable midget science tutor to eat Italian food and talk technobabble, the comic makes the point of “How come Spider-Man never thought to call the cops to provide backup when he was heading over to take out supervillains?” which is still another thing Peter is amazed he didn’t think of, and

Spoiler

Otto shoots Massacre dead at the urging of the victims he just saved from him. And then the media praises him for it.

Definitely a major plot development, given that Ghost-Peter has been keeping on Otto this whole time to make sure something like that DIDN’T happen. And now Otto looks to be getting ready to use his now-equipped-with-facial-recognition-software spider-bots as a Spider-Gestapo, and we’ll see if he turns into a one-man corrupt police force (they’d been hinting at this last issue, with Otto ‘preventing’ crime by using himself as a fear-inducing presence), and with this issue establishing for all those criminals out there

Spoiler

that the Superior Spider-Man is willing to kill

this might even work for him. The story is likely going to come down to a juxtaposition of whether the methods Otto’s heading towards really make him a ‘Superior’ Spider-Man or not, and how for better or for worse, this is the new current identity of the character. That’s what this issue was mainly about, moving away from showing how Otto’s lifestyle clashes with his attempts to be Peter Parker from before and moving into setting up his own identity and status quo (hence the introduction of elements of a college setting, the Spider-Bots, and the aforementioned adorable midget science tutor who already has shades of a love interest for our brain-switched-bad-guy main character). This issue has all the over-the-top conceptual excess I expect and want from the series, and actually manages to weave some damn cleverly implemented ideas in at the same time. I’m genuinely wanting to read the next issue now to see where Slott is going with this, not just which direction the train will crash next, there’s some killer potential with what they’ve set up here. Bravo, gentlemen.

[Onslaught Six]

I'm amazed that Superior Spiderman sounds this good. Are you sure you're not reading into things that aren't there, like you did with RID?

[138 Scourge]

For what its worth, we don't 100% know for sure that Otto shot Massacre dead. It's sure as hell heavily implied, yes, but Slott does enjoy screwing with us now and again.

Or to pit it another way: Massacre is the new Thundercracker.

[BWprowl]

I'm amazed that Superior Spiderman sounds this good.

Believe me, I was just as shocked myself when I got to the end of the issue last night and realized just how much I’d genuinely enjoyed what I’d just read, instead of simply being amused by its train-wreck value. Don’t get me wrong, the ridiculous concepts that drive this series are still *there*, and they’re a vital component of what makes the series what it is, and you can sure as hell appreciate them (supervillain goes back to college, robot-spider-gestapo, etc.) but when you’ve got that AND interesting ideas and solid, entertaining storytelling? This book that *shouldn’t* work gets dangerously close to being fully legitimately really good.

Spoiler

If you feel compelled to give it a look, I’m sure you can readily find scans somewhere. This is the most talked-about comic of the year so far, I think.

Are you sure you're not reading into things that aren't there, like you did with RID?

Nah, I think I’ve actually got this one figured out. Considering ‘Superior’ is right there in the title and the subject of Otto trying to be ‘superior’ and how he goes about it and how Peter reacts to these methods (often begrudgingly admitting that Otto’s methods work and are things he should have thought of before) makes it pretty clear that ‘Superiority’, what defines it, and how a super-villain in a super-hero’s place can accomplish such things is a major driving theme of this book. And like Scarlet Spider and its own themes, this series is exceptionally focused on that idea, which I appreciate. Each issue comes across like it knows what it’s trying to accomplish, what it’s trying to establish about Otto As Spider-Man.

For what its worth, we don't 100% know for sure that Otto shot Massacre dead. It's sure as hell heavily implied, yes, but Slott does enjoy screwing with us now and again.

Or to pit it another way: Massacre is the new Thundercracker.

Fair enough. Even leading up to the moment I considered the possibility that Otto would just, I dunno, shoot off all of Massacre’s arms and legs and leave him crippled or something. He certainly shot *something*, which we see before it cuts to the aftermath. The interesting part about doing it this way is that EVERYONE in the story knows whether Spidey killed Massacre, but we as the audience don’t. And considering the characters’ behavior in the future of the story strongly depends on one action or the other, we’ll likely know for sure sooner rather than later. At least the epilogue of this one, where Otto terrorizes the burger joint CEO who paid Massacre, strongly implies that the public now views Spider-Man as an executioner.

Damn, now I really can’t wait for the next issue, thanks a lot, man! I’m glad this book is bimonthly.