We've got Hall of Fame voting going on up there

[Onslaught Six]

Perhaps that's part of the point--that'd make it a lot more interesting, if nothing else.

Let's face it, all of these characters (with the exception of Dinobot) have been huge players in the franchise since day one, and they're likely to be nominated again for next year (if they have fan voting) or inducted wholesale. So no matter who gets in this year, next year will likely have several, if not all, of the other nominees. So regardless of Soundwave or Shockwave or Grimlock winning, everyone will make it to next year.

[Dominic]

Each vote you cast for an alternate character cancels out a vote for another. If I vote for Soundwave on Monday, Grimlock on Tuesday, Jazz on Wednesday, Shockwave on Thursday and Dinobot on Friday, I have not voted meaningfully to any of them.

That stupid write-up just about puts me off of voting for Jazz. I know that BW saved the franchise. But, after the better part of a decade of really bad content and dealing with furries, I cannot vote for Dinobot. Soundwave...well, you know my feelings there. And, that just leaves Grimlock and Shockwave



Dom
-bulleting for Shockwave.

[Onslaught Six]

Arguably, though, I could vote for Soundwave, Shockwave, Jazz and Grimlock--effectively cancelling out a vote for Dinobot.

Dinobot has a really dumb name. Seriously. It shows something that I've gotten confused and written "Grimlock" instead at least three or four times over the last few days. It doesn't even say what kind of dinosaur he is! Raptortron would be better.

[Dominic]

Objectively, Dinobot is not a bad choice. I just have my own reasons for not voting Dinobot.


My detailed thoughts:


Character voting is open until May 28:
http://www.hasbro.com/transformers/en_U ... E-Poll.cfm


I am voting for Shockwave. I like most of the characters on the list. But, Shockwave is getting my vote by virtue of having a strong presence even with a minimal role on the cartoon. Back in the 80s, "Transformers" was presented as toys, comics and a cartoon. People often forget how important the comics were to the franchise. (The comics are what carried the franchise into the early 90s and were the only content during G2.) Licensiing issues kept Shockwave's presence on the cartoon to a minimum. But, the character played a consistently important role in the comics. Shockwave also played a significant role in the old UK comics. The Hall of Fame write-up is also pretty well written.


Shockwave is probably the longest shot on the list though:

Soundwave: Soundwave is one of those characters that was pretty much everyone's favorite as a kid. I admit to having no small sentimental attachment here. But, as much as I loved Soundwave as a kid and still have a soft spot in my heart for any character that has pets, Soundwave is one of the more dated characters in the franchise. There are people in college now who likely have never seen Soundwave's alternate form, a cassette player, in real life. Soundwave's Hall of Fame write-up lists his tape-troops as Minicons, which raises the ire of the toy-hack crowd. If I was going to vote for Soundwave, that would be reason enough.

Grimlock: I admit, I seriously considered voting for Grimlock. The character objectively has broader appeal than Shockwave, with strong appearances in both the cartoons and comics over the years. In addition to playing a role in the US and UK, Grimlock is also recognizable in Japan. But, Shockwave is a bit more consistently portrayed than Grimlock. (I might vote for Grimlock a few times, as voting restarts every day.)

Jazz: This one should have been a slam-dunk. Jazz is iconic, even making it into 2007 movie in a recognizable way. Jazz is one of the few G1 characters where every re-use of the name has unambiguously been the same character. But, Jazz's "Hall of Fame" write up is...terrible. I am fine with Hasbro revising characters. But, unlike the tweaks to Soundwave, (renaming his tapes as Minicons), that make the character less dated, the changes to Jazz just read like bad fanfic, or the sort of thing that the fanclub would produce.

Dinobot: There is a real case for voting for Dinobot. "Transformers" is not just an 80s property. (The only people who argue otherwise are the more egocentric toy-hacks and/or those who are resistant to change in their hobbies.) And, it is good, (if a bit suprising), to see a character from the Beast-era even nominated for the Hall of Fame. "Beast Wars" saved the franchise in the mid 90s. Dinobot's death in the series is considered by some fans to be the best moment in the history of the franchise. (I would not go that far, but will concede it is probably the best moment in terms of "Transformers" on television.) But, since '01, just about everything "Beast"-related has been terrible. And, "Beast Wars" may have saved the franchise, but it also brought furries into the fandom.


The real folk:
I can think of other choices I would have made for this first batch of inductees. But, none of them are bad choices.

http://www.hasbro.com/transformers/en_U ... EMBERS.cfm

Bob Budiansky:
One of the strongest parts of the "Transformers" brand has always been the intellectual property. Budiansky built much of the foundation for "Transformers" that fans now take for granted. The characters having personalities beyond their names, (ala "Go-Bots!"), was mostly Budiansky. The character profiles that people have wanted to see expanded on in stories over the years were largely written by Budiansky. The fact that people expect TF packages to have character and story content on the back is due in part to Budiansky. There are other people who contributed to the franchise at the beginning, including Ralph Macchio (the comic editor, not the actor), Jim Shooter, Nelson Yomtov, and Herb Trimpe. (And, that list only includes other people working at Marvel, and ignores people working in-house at Hasbro.) But, Budiansky's role was often over-looked, even denigrated, in the 90s. I am can totally support this one.


Peter Cullen:
Cullen's voice went a long way to defiining Optimus Prime. Gary Chalk's voice may have the "oomph" of an energetic and beloved uncle. Scott McNeill has grace to more than match his (enviable) talent. But, Cullen defined Prime. To this day, when I read a TF comic, it is Cullen's voice I hear for Prime's thoughts and dialogue, and that can sometimes cover for some pretty bad writing. Part of me would like to see the late Chris Latta nominated for his work as Starscream, (another character defining voice). And, the petulant part of me wants to see Orson Welles, whose disdain for "Transformers" was well known.


The next two nominees speak very well of Hasbro. Hasbro markes the toys in the US, but they are nominating two guys from Takara. Kudos to Hasbro for keeping these nominations meaningful. Say what I will about Hasbro, but their Hall of Fame is not just a series of in-house pats on the back.


Yoke Hideaki: This guy is responsible for the "Microman" line. For that alone, I almost want to argue that he should be on another list entirely. ("Microman" is a truly amazing line, relating to both "GI Joe" and "Transformers".) Hideaki is also credited with creating a number of toys there were later presented as TFs, including Soundwave.

Kojin Ohno: Another Microman guy, Ohno is credited with working on the old Diaclone line where many of the original TF vehicles were drawn from. He also played a role in designing Fortress Maximus and with launching the "Beast Wars" brand in Japan.



Dom
-plans to post more FCBD reviews this week. Honestly. No, really. Totally going to.

[andersonh1]

My choices:

#1 - Soundwave is easily one of the best-remembered Transformers from the G1 line. He isn't one of many visually similar cars or jets. His unique alternate mode was a microcassette player, which led to cassette minions that could interact with the larger figure. This was a novelty at the time and was used extensively on the TV series. Combine the play pattern with the cartoon version's unique voice, and Soundwave easily stands out among the vast number of characters in the Transformers line. The character is so strongly identified with sound and his tape minion interaction that to this day remakes and redesigns are either based around that or incorporate elements into the design, even when the character is a stealth bomber (Cybertron) or a satellite (ROTF). Soundwave is a memorable character whose distinguishing characteristics were established so strongly that they've remained definitive despite the outdated nature of cassette recorders.

#2- I had originally put Grimlock at #3 behind Shockwave, but the character has been very prominent in all versions of the comics thanks to Simon Furman's fondness for him. The cartoon version was dimwitted but had a memorable voice, and that "voice" and pattern of speaking carried over into the comics, even if the character we saw on the page developed into an intelligent and dangerous fighter who had a speech impediment. Grimlock is a major player in Marvel's late G1 issues, all through G2, and in both Dreamwave and to some extent IDW's comics. He even turns up in Beast Wars, thanks to a Dinobot repaint in the toyline that was clearly meant to be the G1 character. Remakes have almost always retained some vestige of the mechanical dinosaur mode, or the speech impediment, or some other aspect of the character that was established back in the early days of G1. Like Soundwave, this is a character that has lasting appeal.

#3 - like Soundwave, Shockwave stands out due to his nearly unique alternate mode, his simple but effective color scheme and his monoptical face with antenna. He's very visually distinct. The TV series used him sparingly if distinctively by leaving him behind and in control of Cybertron, so it was the comics that really fleshed out the character as a strong challenger to Megatron and a force to be reckoned with who could defeat Dinobots and entire groups of Autobots. IDW and Dreamwave have both made strong use of the character as well. His characterization as logical and analytical is also rare among Decepticons.

#4 - Dinobot comes in ahead of Jazz, because the character was better developed and was given a memorable death in one of the best episodes of Beast Wars. Scott McNeil's voice acting is just great, and really brought the character to life. Genuine faction-switchers are fairly rare in Transformers fiction, and having Dinobot switch sides because he hated Megatron meant that he didn't have to abandon all his Predacon values, and his loyalties could be suspect from time to time. All of this led to good drama and character conflict on both sides. And Dinobot genuinely grew as a character over the course of the series until he finally gave his life to protect the future, something the character would not have done in episode 1. The toy isn't all that impressive, but the characterization in the TV series sells Dinobot.

#5 - In my opinion, Jazz is a fan favorite because of Scatman Crothers voice. Really, what else could have done it? He's not all that distinctive, character-wise, from many other Autobots. But he was a little more prominent in the early cartoon episodes, and he had that great voice. Never understimate a good voice actor's ability to bring the character to life. Cullen did it with Prime, Chris Latta did it with Starscream, Frank Welker did it with tons of characters, and Scatman Crothers brought Jazz to life. Look at the character in the first movie, who lacks the charm of Crothers' version, but who is nonetheless voiced by a black actor who loves earth slang and is a sportscar and Prime's lieutenant. He's a lot closer to his G1 incarnation than Bumblebee, Ironhide or Ratchet.

I don't really let modern rewritten bios bother me... these guys have stood the test of time. They are who they are, and will likely continue to remain strong and well-remembered characters.

[Onslaught Six]

1) Soundwave. He's Soundwave!

2) Shockwave. Marvel #5 is still one of the few TF comic covers I want to own as a poster. THE TRANSFORMERS ARE ALL DEAD. It does not get more awesome than that.

3) Grimlock. Grimlock's important--especially whenever he becomes Autobot Leader. He shows that Prime's way of doing things really isn't always the way that will get things done. In a way, Grimlock's arguments are right--and the fact that he even exists to challenge them is very important, and shows that the franchise can be multi-faceted and say things that aren't just "Good guys beat the bad guys."

4) Jazz. Jazz is just as distinctive as any other of the '84 and '85 cast, who are all pretty well-developed core characters with different personality traits that make them interesting. I think the reason a lot of the '87, '88 and beyond characters don't get a lot of focus is because, in part, their personalities are almost defined by their gimmicks. Crosshairs! Get it, because he's a Targetmaster. Beyond that, he's got nothing. Jazz, though, is a guy who has a personality that isn't defined by his name. (In fact, Jazz likes rock music. What the hell?)

5) Dinobot. Only because...I don't like Dinobot. Let me pose this question: In the 2003 Universe fiction, Primus revived a defender for his power and the entire multiverse. He could've chosen anybody--any number of iterations of G1 Prime, Star Convoy, Pyro, Ginrai, Star Saber, or any number of ArmEnerTron Primes. Who did he choose? 'Optimus Primal.' The best BW character ever. Primal deserves this spot--not Dinobot.

[BWprowl]

Let me pose this question: In the 2003 Universe fiction, Primus revived a defender for his power and the entire multiverse. He could've chosen anybody--any number of iterations of G1 Prime, Star Convoy, Pyro, Ginrai, Star Saber, or any number of ArmEnerTron Primes. Who did he choose? 'Optimus Primal.' The best BW character ever. Primal deserves this spot--not Dinobot.

Okay, I can definitely see where you're coming from here. This is the reason Primal was the #1 spot on my original list, after all. But part of me wants to keep voting for Dinobot out of paranoia that Primal will somehow never get his chance. Plus, in the Hall's inaugural year, I'd just really like to have SOMEONE on the list who isn't from '84.

Notes that Dom is taking full advantage of Synjo's absence to bash on furries. Awesome.

[Dominic]

The comment was less Synjo-inspired than you might think. While taking a wiki break during recent studying binge, I discovered crypto-zoology. I had an over-active imagination as a kid...and I could not have matched some of those people.

Does the world not hold enough wonder?

5) Dinobot. Only because...I don't like Dinobot. Let me pose this question: In the 2003 Universe fiction, Primus revived a defender for his power and the entire multiverse. He could've chosen anybody--any number of iterations of G1 Prime, Star Convoy, Pyro, Ginrai, Star Saber, or any number of ArmEnerTron Primes. Who did he choose? 'Optimus Primal.' The best BW character ever. Primal deserves this spot--not Dinobot.

And, Primus decided to color his avatar the color of poo. Seriously, aside from the metallic bits, every color on "Universe" Optimus Primal could pass from a human rectum. Maybe not a healthy rectum, but a rectum just the same.

Dom
-challenges Owlman to pistols at dawn.

[BWprowl]

Y'know, I think it'd be funny if, with so many people going "Okay, Soundwave's got this locked up, so I'll just throw my vote to someone else", that Soundwave ends up NOT winning. Basically, everyone assumes everyone else is going to vote for Soundwave, so they don't vote for Soundwave. I'll laugh my ass off.

Back onto the subject of Dinobot and BW fandom being a driving point down in voting for him, I just want to say that I try not to let a bad fandom ruin something that I enjoy. Part of it comes from the knowing that I was a lot like these Beast Wars kids at one point in my life, and I turned out okay, so maybe there's hope. And really, if they do get too annoying, I can just ignore them and throw on 'The Agenda', and everything's cool again. On the other hand, I am rethinking my voting for Dinobot, since I know if he wins, then David Willis is going to claim all the credit on that one (now THERE'S a member of the fandom I'm rapidly tiring of).

Heh, maybe the reason I love Energon so much is because I *am* the entire Energon fandom, so I can't exactly be annoyed by them.

[Dominic]

What if you have self-loathing issues though? Then, "Energon" fans would terribly annoying.

I hate to say it, but Willis does seem to have enough weight in the fandom, (note the activity at his blog), that his endorsement could sway, if not carry, a vote.

Thankfully, his influence does not extend to anything much more important than "Transformers".

Part of it comes from the knowing that I was a lot like these Beast Wars kids at one point in my life, and I turned out okay, so maybe there's hope.

What the hell are you talking about? I have known your for what, 17 years? You were in the "sucks to be around" years when we met, and you were not that bad. And, most of the beast kids are ball-park the same age as you...youngster.

Dom
-wants a photoshopped picture of a "Soundwave Wins!" newspaper.....