Primal and AirRazor- love in the air ;)

[Gomess]

If something like that can exist officially...

Um... What do you mean by "exist officially"? 'Cos, I dunno how up you are on your creative copyright lingo, but Kiss Players is doujin. In Japan, a doujin circle isn't required to purchase the rights to a property before publishing works based on it. It's totally normalised there. What I'm trying to say is, like eHobby, Takara had no part in creating Kiss Players, even though they give it a sideways approval by treating them like a second party company.

That said, yes, O6 is being naive to assume no fans have fantasised about the few female characters in a male-dominated franchise before. Personally, I developed my taste in ladies from an early age, and Arcee just Wasn't My Type, so I never fell into that trap. =p

[Onslaught Six]

If something like that can exist officially...

Um... What do you mean by "exist officially"? 'Cos, I dunno how up you are on your creative copyright lingo, but Kiss Players is doujin. In Japan, a doujin circle isn't required to purchase the rights to a property before publishing works based on it. It's totally normalised there. What I'm trying to say is, like eHobby, Takara had no part in creating Kiss Players, even though they give it a sideways approval by treating them like a second party company.

Wait, what? Dude, no, KP had toys and everything. Unless you know something that the entire rest of the fandom don't, because we've all been treating it as official...

EDIT: Not to mention there were radio plays and shit. And Takara has it as part of their timeline (which isn't saying much, since that timeline included the live-action film and G1 in the same timeline...yeah...) and the latter parts of the manga (which amazingly stopped being squicky) had weird shit like Brave Maximus going back in time to become Fortress Maximus.

That said, yes, O6 is being naive to assume no fans have fantasised about the few female characters in a male-dominated franchise before. Personally, I developed my taste in ladies from an early age, and Arcee just Wasn't My Type, so I never fell into that trap. =p

I'm not saying that kind of fanfic doesn't exist for other TF series (the sheer number of bad TFP Arcee fanart I've ALREADY seen is proof of that) but it's far more copious when it comes to BW.

[Gomess]

Like I said, doujin is really outside of the western perception of "official". You know how hentai doujin are so prevalent in Japan? It might surprise you to know that the companies who own the copyrights on those characters have no problem with them growing extra genitals or being accosted by tentacle monsters. When was the last time you walked into a respectable comic book store and saw "The Uncanny XXX-Men" or whatever within a metre of 'real' comics? There's a reason you haven't.

In some cases, Japanese companies- particularly certain anime studios coughgainaxcough- have even encouraged doujin circles' production. Like I also implied (with the "second party company" comment), Takara producing toys based on Kiss Players is no different than [anime studio] producing cosplay figures based on [prominent h-doujin]. It happens. Copyright's much looser in Japan.

Soyeah, in summation, Kiss Players is a doujin which Takara has allowed to become part of their Transformers canon. Whether that's "official" or not is best not wasting our tiny western minds thinking about.

EDIT: Of course, I could be wrong, and Takara came up with it all by themselves, but (a) That's not what I heard, and (b) I doubt they would, but (c) I've been out of the TF loop for almost ten years, so. *shrug!*

[Dominic]

And what would you call Kiss Players? If something like that can exist officially... I'm sure you can find fanfiction for every Transformers franchise, its not always with Beast Wars

Stop. Stop now. Why are you bringing up "Kiss Prey"?


Takara allowing "Kiss Play" to happen, and making it part of their timeline, treating it as a second/third party product, kind of makes it official, loose copyrights be damned.

In Japan, editiorial standards are much lower in general, (as evidenced by the timeline that O6 describes). But, in the US, as O6 pointed out, BW is responsible for an unusually high degree of (if it need be specified, bad) fanfic. At this point, I would say the great-king-daddy of all fanfic inspirations is "Harry Potter". But, "Beast Wars" still caused more than its share of bad fanfic.


Dom
-still ashamed of the franchise for allowing "Kiss Play".

[Sparky Prime]

Stop. Stop now. Why are you bringing up "Kiss Prey"?

Simply to point out it isn't always Beast Wars, and that every franchise of Transformers has its share of bad fanfics, and then there's Kiss Players...

Um... What do you mean by "exist officially"? 'Cos, I dunno how up you are on your creative copyright lingo, but Kiss Players is doujin.

Unfortunately, no, it wasn't doujin. It was an official franchise of Transformers created by Takara, trying to find a new way promote the last few Binaltech molds since those lines didn't do so well in Japan.

[Dominic]

Stop. Stop now. Why are you bringing up "Kiss Prey"?

Simply to point out it isn't always Beast Wars, and that every franchise of Transformers has its share of bad fanfics, and then there's Kiss Players...{/quote]


Like O6 said though, BW has more than others. And, that segment of the fanbase is more vocal.

Kiss Play is just terrible. It sounds like "doujin" is "like Mosaic, but a little more official". In any case, "Kiss Play" is official, as much as we may wish otherwise.


Dom
-still chuckles at Blackarachnia's original file card.

[BWprowl]

EDIT: Of course, I could be wrong, and Takara came up with it all by themselves, but (a) That's not what I heard, and (b) I doubt they would, but (c) I've been out of the TF loop for almost ten years, so. *shrug!*

Just for posterity, so everyone can stop being confused: Kiss Players at TFwiki. It was 100% official, made by Takara and Yuki Oshima. The Japanese are just that effing crazy.

And as for which TF series get more shipping, O6, I'm sure you haven't missed all the crap Animated gets?

[Sparky Prime]

Like O6 said though, BW has more than others. And, that segment of the fanbase is more vocal.

I really don't see that BW necessarily has more than any other TF franchise. Granted, that part of the fanbase is pretty vocal, but that doesn't mean they write more fanfics. If you actually go looking for it, you can find plenty of fanfics for any Transformers franchise.

[Gomess]

Just for posterity, so everyone can stop being confused: Kiss Players at TFwiki. It was 100% official, made by Takara and Yuki Oshima. The Japanese are just that effing crazy.

Hmm, that article doesn't say anything about Takara being involved in the initial creative process. I'm sticking with it being a doujin work by Yuki Oshima that Takara co-opted. That's what I heard when it first came out, and it's not like it's uncommon.

I'm not in denial, I just haven't seen any actual proof that Takara created Kiss Players. Even their copyright stamp means little, because that's also common doujin practice, and Oshima's name is still more prominent on the licensing. The biggest gap for me is: If Takara had created it, there would've been a cartoon to cash in! =p As far as I can see, Kiss Players is on the same level as eHobby and the TFCC; second party canon.

And since we brought Japan up: oMg AiRaZoR iS a DoOd!! pRiMaL iS gHeY mUnKy!!!

[Sparky Prime]

The biggest gap for me is: If Takara had created it, there would've been a cartoon to cash in! =p

So by that logic: Return of Convoy, Operation Combination, Binaltech, Binaltech*, Alternity, Henkei! Henkei! and United also weren't created by Takara since none of them had cartoons either? Face it Gomess, no matter how you try to deny it, Kiss Players was a creation of Taraka.