All Hail Megatron Discussion thread

[Dominic]

Barry Allen was the Silver Age Flash, making him one of the most important characters in comics. His death in "Crisis on Infinite Earths" #8 was one of the most important character deaths in comics, having multiple layers of meaning and adding far more to the character in death than he had in life.

Up until 2008, it was simply understood that "Barry Allen ought not return" for any reason. But, a few years ago, DC ran out of Ideas (in the higher sense of the word), and after much hype and indecision, they brought back Barry Allen in a stupid hype event story. This pretty well killed my interest in modern DC.

I am betting that "Transformers" is going to go the same route as main-stream superhero comics, including commiting many of the same sins, like bringing back characters with meaningful deaths just to make things "like they was".

Thundercracker and Sunstreaker, (or any TF character for that matter), are not as important as Barry Allen. (I do not care if this is a fan board. TF is not *that* important to comics.) But, scale aside, bringing them back will still be a similarly bad idea.


Dom
-still reads DC for morbid curiosity....sometimes....if at all.

[Shockwave]

Ah, well I suppose "important" in regards to comics is subjective. I don't read DC. I pretty much die hard read TF, so in my comic reading Thundy and Sunstreaker would both be far more important than Barry Allen. In the industry in general however I would agree with you since he's one of the main characters for one of the top 2 comic book companies.

[andersonh1]

All I'm seeing is that he's pissed off at Thundercracker because he thinks he has betrayed the Decepticons. But he still has it within him to talk (well, yell at him at any rate) to Thundercracker before he blasts him. With that in mind, couldn't he wait a few more seconds for Thundercracker to try and explain his side? After all, that's the "civil" and "brotherly" thing to do. That's the whole point I'm getting at.

Skywarp didn't want to hear what Thundercracker had to say. He saw the whole thing, and had already made up his mind what he was going to do. Anything Thundercracker could have said at that point was irrelevant. Clearly it was a "heat of the moment" decision by Skywarp, made in anger at what he saw as a betrayal. The finer details of Decepticon philosophy just weren't important. Skywarp's anger was driving his actions, not rational thought.

And that's a realistic reaction. How many people react to something that makes them angry by "blowing up" and lashing out, only to later calm down and regret their actions? I'd be willing to be Skywarp would have second thoughts later as well.

[Dominic]

And, even so, the regret is contingent upon Skywarp reflecting on it. He might not lament shooting Thundercracker so much as he might lament Thundercracker's actions making it necessary.

Ah, well I suppose "important" in regards to comics is subjective. I don't read DC.

Only the most hard-core partisan would ignore the impact "Crisis on Infinite Earths" had on comics. That story changed comics as an industry, for good or ill. And, it was understood that Barry Allen's death was meant to stick.

I recommend anyone who likes comics read CoIE. It is far from pefect. In fact, it is tedious in places. But, it is still worth reading if only for what DC was trying to do.


Dom
-why does this thread keep getting into comics, while the comics thread keeps getting into TF?!?!?!????

[andersonh1]

And, even so, the regret is contingent upon Skywarp reflecting on it. He might not lament shooting Thundercracker so much as he might lament Thundercracker's actions making it necessary.

That's exactly right. It depends how introspective Skywarp is, and I suspect he's not very deep given his character as portrayed in comics and tech specs. He's more likely to say "Why did Thundercracker make me do that?" and blame Thundercracker than he is to say "What have I done?" and place the blame on himself.

[Dominic]

In fairness to Skywarp, there is a moral case for shooting Thundercracker. He did break ranks on the field. And, it is not unreasonable to expect an adult (like Thundercracker) to recongnize the difference between rhetoric and political/practical expediency.


Dom
-well this beats talking about the Matrix.

[andersonh1]

In fairness to Skywarp, there is a moral case for shooting Thundercracker. He did break ranks on the field.

True enough, which is why Skywarp no doubt felt fully justified in taking the actions that he did. The question is, will Skywarp regret shooting his friend? I doubt that if it had been just about anyone else that he'd question the rightness of shooting a traitor after witnessing the treason take place, but the fact that Thundercracker is his friend could be what would cause him to rethink his actions, if anything.

And, it is not unreasonable to expect an adult (like Thundercracker) to recongnize the difference between rhetoric and political/practical expediency.

As for Thundercracker, I'm sure he thought he'd have a chance to explain what he did and why, and be exonerated for taking a stand on principle. He didn't count on Skywarp being so angry about it.

[Shockwave]

I'm kind of wondering McCarthy wasn't somewhat inspired by MoviePrime. Megs needs to be taken out: Shot to the face! Thundy goes down: Shot to the face!

I was just saying the CoiE had no direct impact on my comic reading since I only read TF and Buffy. I was reading Marvel at one point but stopped after Secret Invasion. So in the scheme of my comic reading it was unimportant. Now that doesn't mean that I can't recognize it's impact on the industry as a whole. The movie industry has certainly had movies that changed the industry. Star Wars is a good example of this since it pretty much revolutionized how special effects and merchandising were done and set the standard for a lot of movies since. I didn't see any change to either TF of Buffy so I'll have to have CoiE's importance explained to me.

[Dominic]

As for Thundercracker, I'm sure he thought he'd have a chance to explain what he did and why, and be exonerated for taking a stand on principle. He didn't count on Skywarp being so angry about it.

I was thinking more along the lines of "Thundercracker was an adult, and should have known that frand poltical speeches and practical ops are two different things." In other words, as much as he liked the stated ideals of his faction, he should have understood that every so often the operational details will not match up.

If nothing else, what could he reasonably have expected the other Decepticons to do? Even if he could talk Skywarp down, somebody else is gonna nail him.



-see the comics thread for the CoIE thoughts.

[Shockwave]

I kind of got the impression that he was hoping no one would know.